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[Music]

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number

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the smoke radio for the masses headline

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edition july 8th 1947.

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the army air forces has announced that a

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flying disk has been found and is now in

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the possession of the army if the game

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is rigged change the game

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game changer

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i occasionally think how quickly

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our differences worldwide

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would vanish

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if we were facing an alien threat from

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outside this world

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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this is fade to black with your host

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jimmy church on the game changer radio

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network and kgra the global radio

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i need your help to get to the year

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[Music]

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you're listening to fade to flag with

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jimmy church on the game changer network

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[Music]

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good evening

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bespoke radio

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for

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masses

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yeah man

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how you doing

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today's monday august 9th 2021

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222 days into the new year only 143 days

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left

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we are live from a bunker somewhere in

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an absolute total

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undisclosed location

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that's right

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but it is beautiful

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it is

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man it's good to be back on the air had

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a very very very busy weekend

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one day one day i'll tell everybody

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the whole story

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but right now

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let's just say i had a very

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very busy weekend

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so glad to be back here on the air with

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i truly mean it it's a busy weekend i'm

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going to get to to most of it in just a

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second but right now i would like to

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welcome everybody listening all around

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the world all across the united states

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hither and tither to and fro back and

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forth up and down east and west north

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and south far and near

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[Music]

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this is spade to block for kjcr the game

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changer network

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and kgra the planet i am your host jimmy

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church what is cracking everybody how

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you doing how you doing race hops

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i got

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or text tweet text today from uh

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racehobbs and man you make me laugh race

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you're the best i hope you're listening

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right now i think that he is i think

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that he is um

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uh we've got a very

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very busy very amazing week coming up on

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fade to black and uh

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i had to grab something i don't you know

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what i don't even know why i moved it

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earlier

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it was here for a reason

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i moved it over there onto a table

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that's like 10 feet away what you know

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and then now i've moved it back but i'll

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show you why in just a second

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all right tonight

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very special guest richard bleepin dolan

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is here

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and i've told everybody all day today a

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little bit yesterday

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about what's going down tonight

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richard and i are going to do a full

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review and analysis

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of showtime's new docu-series called ufo

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by j.j abrams

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that's tonight

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and then tomorrow night stephen bassett

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is here we're going to talk about the

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new netflix series secret ufo projects

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proudly featuring

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stephen bassett and a host of of others

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including richard dolan that is tomorrow

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night

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dr robert m shock is here we will be

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discussing amongst other things

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but the new revised and expanded edition

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of his book forgotten civilization this

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is what i put on the other table when i

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was supposed to have it right here in

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front of me but i put it on the other

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table which makes no sense but now it's

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here in front of me this is it the new

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expanded and revised edition of

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forgotten civilization we will be

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talking full of illustrations and

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photographs and

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color and all of that so that's

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wednesday night here on fade to black

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now i can put this back over here

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and then thursday night of course is

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open lines

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open man we had a great fader night on

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thursday didn't we

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yeah man these fader nights are getting

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harder and harder to top

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they're just amazing uh all of your

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phone calls okay so that's thursday

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night

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uh a couple of things i've got uh a

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bunch

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of conferences that are coming up over

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the next three months

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august 18th is

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uh making contact

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i need you to go to

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makingcontact.com this is a virtual you

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will have your own avatar this is a

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virtual

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um uh

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ar reality on an uh this virtual island

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the making contact island so you need to

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go

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get registered then you need to

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download the software of the island

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and

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of the campus the making contact campus

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and get your avatar done i've already

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done mine it's pretty cool going to do

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that then you can go and explore the

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island and walk around and go and find

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the auditorium because that is where you

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are going to be august 18th 19th 20th

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21st and 22nd it is a five day

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conference that

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starts august 18th

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the promo code for you to save a hundred

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dollars off the 249 ticket price it's a

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five-day event

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in this virtual world it is absolutely

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incredible

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worth every penny and then you're gonna

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go back and check out other events in

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the future too as well

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jimmy save 100 all uppercase you need to

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use that promo code and get that done

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then coming up right after that in

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september september 18th

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19th

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is the conscious life expos taking place

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it's in person it's live taking place in

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two cities

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los angeles

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and london

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los angeles is up first as soon as we're

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done with the day in los angeles we go

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over to london hilton hotel

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in los angeles at the lax hilton then

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the hilton in london

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okay both in-person events so

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uh get your tickets now this is also

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streaming it's a simulcast

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so you can go and get your tickets you

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can come and hang out with me i'll have

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the fade to black booth and everything

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else

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at the lax hilton i'll be hosting all

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weekend long for

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los angeles i'm not going to be doing

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london i'm not there right

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but uh but come and hang out with us at

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the lax hilton

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consciouslifeexpo.com

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promo code for that event is jimmy

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j-i-m-m-y

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and uh you'll get a discount i think

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it's 20

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i might be wrong 10 20 off the tickets

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there

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um so go and figure it out if you can't

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be there in person i get that

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uh get the streaming packages and all of

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that is there for you

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man my headphones again are acting funny

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it's weird it just throws me off okay uh

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so that is that and then coming up in

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november

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is star works in laughlin nevada at the

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aquarius hotel and casino go to

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starworksusa.com

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for tickets and info and speakers and

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all of that so yes

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very very very busy three months coming

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up all right

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and uh man is it

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is it the plug is it

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is it the plug well now it's not mate

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man

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i think i need some contact spray which

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is sitting right up there

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that's about 15 feet away but i can see

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it on the shelf

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i need that contact spray

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gotta spray

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got to do that

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all right all right where am i so that

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that's taking care of the next three

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months okay so makingcontact.com

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consciouslifeexpo.com

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starworksusa.com tickets and info at all

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three sites

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there you go um now i you know what i

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wanna i wanna digress i've got so much

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other stuff i gotta cover right now but

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i wanna mention something it's the

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little things in life right okay

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so 10 years ago

231
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uh building the studio and and doing

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this and doing that and and i'm at fry's

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in burbank uh shopping for stuff and i

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remembered i wanted

235
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a cell phone stand to put my cell phone

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on

237
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right i'm at fry's fries has everything

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so i i talked hey do you guys have a

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cell phone stand for my desk that i

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could put uh don't think so you know i'd

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ask

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that's impossible this is fry's

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eventually i found a sales rep and he

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goes yes over there on that aisle and i

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said show me so he walks me over and

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on the shelf hanging

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was this this was the cell phone stand

248
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okay i bought this at fry's 10 years ago

249
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you can see you know it's a little thing

250
00:14:13,030 --> 00:14:10,160
then you put your cell phone on it but

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the problem with this is it sits too

252
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close to

253
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the the desk the table top because you

254
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can't

255
00:14:24,389 --> 00:14:22,320
plug in your charger right so but anyway

256
00:14:27,110 --> 00:14:24,399
i've had that doesn't have rubber feet

257
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it just sits i've had this on my desk

258
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for 10 years

259
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and

260
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had to

261
00:14:40,550 --> 00:14:37,360
i got to find another cell phone stand

262
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i go onto the internet

263
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my interbox plug-in cell phone stand oh

264
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my god

265
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there are

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thousands of them

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and i bought

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this

269
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look at that now i can

270
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put my and it's rubber it's it's quiet

271
00:15:07,350 --> 00:15:05,360
but i can plug in a jack right it's got

272
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rubber feet it doesn't move it's

273
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adjustable

274
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but this

275
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is a game changer people

276
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this right here

277
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and uh yeah uh ipad

278
00:15:25,430 --> 00:15:22,160
whatever right but it's the little

279
00:15:27,829 --> 00:15:25,440
things in life and i have been enjoying

280
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this for two days and

281
00:15:32,870 --> 00:15:30,480
uh the one that i bought

282
00:15:35,749 --> 00:15:32,880
um and it was cheap i think this was

283
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five bucks or eight bucks or something

284
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and and

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it came in a two pack there's an extra

286
00:15:46,550 --> 00:15:45,430
freaking two-pack

287
00:15:49,670 --> 00:15:46,560
i don't know what i'm gonna do the other

288
00:15:52,870 --> 00:15:49,680
one maybe ipad stand but anyway

289
00:15:56,150 --> 00:15:52,880
i am just so happy and it's rubber and

290
00:15:58,949 --> 00:15:56,160
it doesn't slip out it doesn't move

291
00:16:01,269 --> 00:15:58,959
it's at i am just happy

292
00:16:04,230 --> 00:16:01,279
so i thought i'd share that with you

293
00:16:06,550 --> 00:16:04,240
it's the little things in life

294
00:16:07,509 --> 00:16:06,560
a cell phone stand

295
00:16:08,710 --> 00:16:07,519
yeah

296
00:16:13,269 --> 00:16:08,720
all right

297
00:16:15,829 --> 00:16:13,279
one other thing go and get joe's garage

298
00:16:18,790 --> 00:16:15,839
by uh frank zappa

299
00:16:19,990 --> 00:16:18,800
go and get the album listen to all of it

300
00:16:24,790 --> 00:16:20,000
so you can

301
00:16:30,310 --> 00:16:24,800
listen to the central scrutinizer

302
00:16:32,150 --> 00:16:30,320
so you will understand everything about

303
00:16:33,670 --> 00:16:32,160
this show

304
00:16:36,550 --> 00:16:33,680
and with that

305
00:16:39,269 --> 00:16:36,560
yeah let's get to the breaking news

306
00:16:41,749 --> 00:16:39,279
it was announced today very sad rest in

307
00:16:44,310 --> 00:16:41,759
peace paul hellyer

308
00:16:48,389 --> 00:16:44,320
member of this community for for a very

309
00:16:49,949 --> 00:16:48,399
very long time august 6 1923

310
00:16:53,350 --> 00:16:49,959
to august 8th

311
00:16:55,990 --> 00:16:53,360
2021. in a brief statement by his family

312
00:16:59,110 --> 00:16:56,000
released today and i quote paul passed

313
00:17:02,629 --> 00:16:59,120
away peacefully last evening at his home

314
00:17:05,510 --> 00:17:02,639
at 6 31 p.m family were by his side

315
00:17:08,870 --> 00:17:05,520
while he was taking his last breaths

316
00:17:11,350 --> 00:17:08,880
singing him a blessing

317
00:17:14,069 --> 00:17:11,360
wow paul was

318
00:17:16,710 --> 00:17:14,079
98 years old and i'll talk more about

319
00:17:19,429 --> 00:17:16,720
this on fader night and the life of paul

320
00:17:21,669 --> 00:17:19,439
hellyer i did meet him once

321
00:17:24,470 --> 00:17:21,679
i spoke to him once

322
00:17:25,829 --> 00:17:24,480
and uh it was

323
00:17:28,150 --> 00:17:25,839
it was uh

324
00:17:30,789 --> 00:17:28,160
actually it was many years ago at the

325
00:17:33,190 --> 00:17:30,799
mufon international symposium he was

326
00:17:35,750 --> 00:17:33,200
speaking and and um i had a brief

327
00:17:36,470 --> 00:17:35,760
opportunity to go up and and talk to him

328
00:17:42,789 --> 00:17:36,480
and

329
00:17:44,789 --> 00:17:42,799
the community is very sad today rest in

330
00:17:46,870 --> 00:17:44,799
peace paul hellyer

331
00:17:48,870 --> 00:17:46,880
all right this news broke this morning i

332
00:17:51,270 --> 00:17:48,880
just want to share this with you because

333
00:17:53,110 --> 00:17:51,280
it's pretty nuts it's about bernie

334
00:17:56,230 --> 00:17:53,120
madoff

335
00:17:59,029 --> 00:17:56,240
that's right the notorious con man

336
00:18:01,669 --> 00:17:59,039
he had multiple toes amputated during

337
00:18:04,789 --> 00:18:01,679
the final days of his battle with kidney

338
00:18:07,029 --> 00:18:04,799
disease the 82 year old madoff who was

339
00:18:10,549 --> 00:18:07,039
serving a 150-year prison sentence as a

340
00:18:12,630 --> 00:18:10,559
result of that 65 billion ponzi scheme

341
00:18:16,390 --> 00:18:12,640
died in a federal prison hospital on

342
00:18:18,470 --> 00:18:16,400
april 14th where a dramatic final week

343
00:18:20,630 --> 00:18:18,480
led to him to having

344
00:18:22,870 --> 00:18:20,640
two toes amputated while he suffered

345
00:18:26,150 --> 00:18:22,880
from hallucinations

346
00:18:29,990 --> 00:18:26,160
after declining dialysis to treat the

347
00:18:32,070 --> 00:18:30,000
disease the fourth toe on his foot later

348
00:18:34,710 --> 00:18:32,080
had to be amputated as a result of

349
00:18:36,950 --> 00:18:34,720
gangrene while the toe next to it had to

350
00:18:38,870 --> 00:18:36,960
be amputated to prevent the infection

351
00:18:42,470 --> 00:18:38,880
from spreading further

352
00:18:45,190 --> 00:18:42,480
madoff's hallucinations became so severe

353
00:18:46,470 --> 00:18:45,200
that at one point he thought he saw a

354
00:18:48,630 --> 00:18:46,480
bird

355
00:18:51,830 --> 00:18:48,640
in a guard's pocket

356
00:18:54,870 --> 00:18:51,840
well on other occasions he believed

357
00:18:56,390 --> 00:18:54,880
people were lurking in his room at night

358
00:18:57,990 --> 00:18:56,400
that part

359
00:19:00,150 --> 00:18:58,000
bernie

360
00:19:03,029 --> 00:19:00,160
wasn't a hallucination

361
00:19:05,110 --> 00:19:03,039
all right tesla's back in the news

362
00:19:07,669 --> 00:19:05,120
the cyber truck

363
00:19:09,510 --> 00:19:07,679
tesla's cyber truck customers will have

364
00:19:11,270 --> 00:19:09,520
to wait a little longer to take delivery

365
00:19:13,590 --> 00:19:11,280
of the electronic truck

366
00:19:16,789 --> 00:19:13,600
as the automaker has delayed production

367
00:19:19,750 --> 00:19:16,799
until 2022

368
00:19:20,950 --> 00:19:19,760
according to tesla's webpage

369
00:19:22,789 --> 00:19:20,960
cybertrek

370
00:19:25,190 --> 00:19:22,799
cybertruck customers will be able to

371
00:19:29,110 --> 00:19:25,200
complete the configuration of the truck

372
00:19:31,190 --> 00:19:29,120
as production nears in 2022 the delay

373
00:19:33,830 --> 00:19:31,200
applies to all models of the cyber truck

374
00:19:36,470 --> 00:19:33,840
the single dual and tri motor all of

375
00:19:38,950 --> 00:19:36,480
this according to tesla and the quiet

376
00:19:41,669 --> 00:19:38,960
push back of production into next year

377
00:19:43,750 --> 00:19:41,679
comes as tesla initially said it would

378
00:19:46,070 --> 00:19:43,760
start shipping trucks in 2021 now i'm

379
00:19:48,310 --> 00:19:46,080
gonna go on the record right now i want

380
00:19:49,830 --> 00:19:48,320
one of these cyber trucks

381
00:19:51,190 --> 00:19:49,840
right now

382
00:19:55,350 --> 00:19:51,200
my

383
00:20:01,750 --> 00:19:55,360
jeep

384
00:20:03,909 --> 00:20:01,760
in my driveway i'll keep it until the

385
00:20:06,470 --> 00:20:03,919
wheels fall off or to my wheels fall off

386
00:20:08,870 --> 00:20:06,480
whatever happens first but but i want a

387
00:20:15,669 --> 00:20:08,880
cyber truck

388
00:20:17,430 --> 00:20:15,679
i want the super duper maybe just the

389
00:20:19,590 --> 00:20:17,440
dual motor may be good enough but the

390
00:20:21,909 --> 00:20:19,600
tri motor sounds pretty nice but they're

391
00:20:24,789 --> 00:20:21,919
so cheap they're inexpensive while

392
00:20:26,789 --> 00:20:24,799
compared to to other things out there

393
00:20:30,230 --> 00:20:26,799
and i'm on a cyber truck but now i have

394
00:20:32,149 --> 00:20:30,240
to wait till 2022 i was hoping to get

395
00:20:33,909 --> 00:20:32,159
one this year let's get this show

396
00:20:35,909 --> 00:20:33,919
cracking happy birthday too jillian

397
00:20:40,549 --> 00:20:35,919
anderson is 53

398
00:20:44,070 --> 00:20:40,559
sam elliott is 77 and bassist kyle kyle

399
00:20:46,830 --> 00:20:44,080
of bangtango is 56. our dead guy's

400
00:20:49,750 --> 00:20:46,840
birthday today is billy henderson

401
00:20:52,870 --> 00:20:49,760
1939-2007 died at the age of 67

402
00:20:54,630 --> 00:20:52,880
billy was an original member and founder

403
00:20:56,789 --> 00:20:54,640
of the spinners

404
00:20:59,590 --> 00:20:56,799
billy and four friends at ferndale high

405
00:21:02,390 --> 00:20:59,600
school in royal oak township michigan in

406
00:21:04,710 --> 00:21:02,400
1954 formed the group

407
00:21:05,990 --> 00:21:04,720
they had several huge hits

408
00:21:08,470 --> 00:21:06,000
huge

409
00:21:09,830 --> 00:21:08,480
all of them toe tappers including i'll

410
00:21:12,149 --> 00:21:09,840
be around

411
00:21:13,750 --> 00:21:12,159
could it be i'm falling in love

412
00:21:17,909 --> 00:21:13,760
then came you

413
00:21:20,630 --> 00:21:17,919
the rubber band man and it's a shame

414
00:21:22,950 --> 00:21:20,640
the spinners spinners nominated for six

415
00:21:24,549 --> 00:21:22,960
grammy awards got a hollywood walk of

416
00:21:26,789 --> 00:21:24,559
fame star

417
00:21:29,990 --> 00:21:26,799
and uh he remained with the group for

418
00:21:31,830 --> 00:21:30,000
over a half a century until 2004. billy

419
00:21:34,789 --> 00:21:31,840
died in daytona beach florida from

420
00:21:39,430 --> 00:21:34,799
complications caused by diabetes on

421
00:21:42,710 --> 00:21:39,440
february 2nd 2007 at the age of 67. on

422
00:21:45,029 --> 00:21:42,720
this day in history 1969 members of

423
00:21:47,669 --> 00:21:45,039
charles manson's cult kill five people

424
00:21:50,549 --> 00:21:47,679
in movie director roman polanski's home

425
00:21:52,390 --> 00:21:50,559
including his pregnant wife sharon tate

426
00:21:54,070 --> 00:21:52,400
less than two days later the group

427
00:21:57,909 --> 00:21:54,080
killed again

428
00:22:01,510 --> 00:21:57,919
murdering supermarket executive leno lee

429
00:22:03,350 --> 00:22:01,520
la bianca and his wife rosemary in their

430
00:22:05,510 --> 00:22:03,360
home fader fact

431
00:22:07,990 --> 00:22:05,520
here you go

432
00:22:09,270 --> 00:22:08,000
there is a group of wolves in british

433
00:22:13,669 --> 00:22:09,280
columbia

434
00:22:16,470 --> 00:22:13,679
known as sea wolves and 90

435
00:22:18,950 --> 00:22:16,480
of their food comes from the sea they're

436
00:22:21,510 --> 00:22:18,960
entirely dedicated to the sea swimming

437
00:22:22,390 --> 00:22:21,520
several miles every day in search of

438
00:22:24,789 --> 00:22:22,400
food

439
00:22:27,510 --> 00:22:24,799
barnacles mussels

440
00:22:29,990 --> 00:22:27,520
herring row they even figured out how to

441
00:22:34,310 --> 00:22:30,000
find crabs by turning over rocks and

442
00:22:35,430 --> 00:22:34,320
they also know how to dig for clams

443
00:22:37,909 --> 00:22:35,440
and that

444
00:22:40,230 --> 00:22:37,919
is your fader fact sea wolves who knew

445
00:22:42,470 --> 00:22:40,240
tonight richard dolan joins us for a

446
00:22:45,990 --> 00:22:42,480
full review and analysis

447
00:22:48,390 --> 00:22:46,000
of showtime's ufo by j.j abrams tomorrow

448
00:22:50,470 --> 00:22:48,400
night steven bassett is here we're going

449
00:22:51,669 --> 00:22:50,480
to talk about the other news series on

450
00:22:55,350 --> 00:22:51,679
netflix

451
00:22:57,590 --> 00:22:55,360
secret ufo projects wednesday night dr

452
00:22:59,029 --> 00:22:57,600
robert m shock is here thursday it's

453
00:23:01,270 --> 00:22:59,039
fader night with open lines all night

454
00:23:02,310 --> 00:23:01,280
long you know what to do

455
00:23:04,789 --> 00:23:02,320
all right

456
00:23:05,669 --> 00:23:04,799
this is it my bespoke phone stand that's

457
00:23:08,310 --> 00:23:05,679
cool

458
00:23:10,230 --> 00:23:08,320
duck roll tape with the c notch that's

459
00:23:11,909 --> 00:23:10,240
pretty cool phillip

460
00:23:14,710 --> 00:23:11,919
that's pretty cool i think i had one of

461
00:23:16,950 --> 00:23:14,720
those once but it didn't hold

462
00:23:18,149 --> 00:23:16,960
a cell phone

463
00:23:22,390 --> 00:23:18,159
yeah

464
00:23:25,110 --> 00:23:22,400
at jchurchradio hashtag f2b is the

465
00:23:27,590 --> 00:23:25,120
sandbox and you can check out phillip

466
00:23:31,430 --> 00:23:27,600
phillips custom

467
00:23:33,990 --> 00:23:31,440
duct tape roll phone stand

468
00:23:36,149 --> 00:23:34,000
all right let's get straight to it

469
00:23:37,909 --> 00:23:36,159
river moon rivermoonwellness.com

470
00:23:41,510 --> 00:23:37,919
fade to black blend best coffee in the

471
00:23:44,789 --> 00:23:42,549
all of the banners are over at

472
00:23:47,269 --> 00:23:44,799
jimmychurchradio.com

473
00:23:49,269 --> 00:23:47,279
promo code f2b blend

474
00:23:50,390 --> 00:23:49,279
all

475
00:23:53,669 --> 00:23:50,400
uh right

476
00:23:55,750 --> 00:23:53,679
over the last week or so or less

477
00:23:58,789 --> 00:23:55,760
actually

478
00:24:01,190 --> 00:23:58,799
it's been about five days our community

479
00:24:03,110 --> 00:24:01,200
has been blessed with three pretty major

480
00:24:05,669 --> 00:24:03,120
ufo releases

481
00:24:10,390 --> 00:24:05,679
all of this by the media last week we

482
00:24:12,310 --> 00:24:10,400
got top secret ufo projects from netflix

483
00:24:14,870 --> 00:24:12,320
and that's been trending on the

484
00:24:17,430 --> 00:24:14,880
streaming platform since its premiere

485
00:24:19,909 --> 00:24:17,440
and yesterday we got showtime's ufo from

486
00:24:21,590 --> 00:24:19,919
jj abrams with all four episodes

487
00:24:24,870 --> 00:24:21,600
released at the same time

488
00:24:28,230 --> 00:24:24,880
if you are a showtime app customer and

489
00:24:31,669 --> 00:24:28,240
subscriber and also yesterday we got

490
00:24:34,070 --> 00:24:31,679
ross cult arts a documentary in plain

491
00:24:36,549 --> 00:24:34,080
sight which finally streamed worldwide

492
00:24:38,470 --> 00:24:36,559
by channel 7 out of australia

493
00:24:40,310 --> 00:24:38,480
before yesterday it was just australia

494
00:24:41,669 --> 00:24:40,320
that got to enjoy it i've tried to find

495
00:24:42,470 --> 00:24:41,679
it many times

496
00:24:46,070 --> 00:24:42,480
well

497
00:24:48,070 --> 00:24:46,080
now i've watched them all

498
00:24:50,710 --> 00:24:48,080
that's right

499
00:24:52,789 --> 00:24:50,720
every episode from netflix all six

500
00:24:55,510 --> 00:24:52,799
episodes i watched them

501
00:24:57,830 --> 00:24:55,520
showtime watched all four episodes more

502
00:25:00,149 --> 00:24:57,840
on that in just a minute and ross is in

503
00:25:02,310 --> 00:25:00,159
plain sight i got that in too from

504
00:25:03,110 --> 00:25:02,320
beginning to end

505
00:25:05,110 --> 00:25:03,120
now

506
00:25:06,310 --> 00:25:05,120
tomorrow night stephen bastet's going to

507
00:25:08,950 --> 00:25:06,320
be here we're going to be talking about

508
00:25:10,950 --> 00:25:08,960
the netflix docu-series and he is

509
00:25:13,110 --> 00:25:10,960
featured throughout all six episodes and

510
00:25:15,190 --> 00:25:13,120
does a great job by the way

511
00:25:17,750 --> 00:25:15,200
and here is some inside info for those

512
00:25:20,470 --> 00:25:17,760
of uh you that may not know or haven't

513
00:25:22,710 --> 00:25:20,480
seen the series yet and that is this

514
00:25:25,830 --> 00:25:22,720
two researchers from europe

515
00:25:27,430 --> 00:25:25,840
shot the series three years ago

516
00:25:29,590 --> 00:25:27,440
three years ago

517
00:25:31,510 --> 00:25:29,600
at the international ufo conference in

518
00:25:33,269 --> 00:25:31,520
phoenix arizona

519
00:25:34,950 --> 00:25:33,279
which means you got most of the speakers

520
00:25:37,190 --> 00:25:34,960
from the conference you got bastard you

521
00:25:40,870 --> 00:25:37,200
got meryl cook caroline corey richard

522
00:25:43,990 --> 00:25:40,880
dolan jj and desiree hertoc

523
00:25:46,390 --> 00:25:44,000
kathleen martin nick pope mary rodwell

524
00:25:48,390 --> 00:25:46,400
she's great by the way michael schratt

525
00:25:50,789 --> 00:25:48,400
is amazing in it of course you you've

526
00:25:53,110 --> 00:25:50,799
got alejandro rojas

527
00:25:54,789 --> 00:25:53,120
because this was filmed three years ago

528
00:25:57,669 --> 00:25:54,799
and released now

529
00:26:00,070 --> 00:25:57,679
you kind of get a time capsule and what

530
00:26:02,149 --> 00:26:00,080
i mean by that is you got what everybody

531
00:26:03,190 --> 00:26:02,159
was thinking back then

532
00:26:05,990 --> 00:26:03,200
okay

533
00:26:09,430 --> 00:26:06,000
this series presents it all pretty well

534
00:26:11,909 --> 00:26:09,440
but it's set three years ago

535
00:26:14,230 --> 00:26:11,919
and although they mentioned ttsa

536
00:26:16,470 --> 00:26:14,240
there's no follow-up about where things

537
00:26:18,710 --> 00:26:16,480
stand today i found that strange and for

538
00:26:20,950 --> 00:26:18,720
most people who are going to watch this

539
00:26:22,390 --> 00:26:20,960
on netflix they're probably

540
00:26:25,029 --> 00:26:22,400
they're not even going to know anything

541
00:26:27,269 --> 00:26:25,039
about de long or elizondo anyway so it

542
00:26:28,950 --> 00:26:27,279
just doesn't matter but don't let any of

543
00:26:30,710 --> 00:26:28,960
this stop you from watching the series

544
00:26:33,510 --> 00:26:30,720
it's certainly worth it there are a

545
00:26:35,510 --> 00:26:33,520
couple of nuggets in there okay and and

546
00:26:38,470 --> 00:26:35,520
dolan and bassett carry things

547
00:26:40,470 --> 00:26:38,480
throughout and again stephen will be

548
00:26:42,470 --> 00:26:40,480
with us tomorrow night to discuss it all

549
00:26:45,350 --> 00:26:42,480
and everything else and he's also got a

550
00:26:46,630 --> 00:26:45,360
very special announcement exclusively

551
00:26:48,870 --> 00:26:46,640
tomorrow night right here on fade to

552
00:26:51,750 --> 00:26:48,880
black but next up we have ross

553
00:26:54,310 --> 00:26:51,760
culthart's documentary in plain sight

554
00:26:56,390 --> 00:26:54,320
lots of hype about this uh release and

555
00:26:58,789 --> 00:26:56,400
it's all worth it and ross certainly

556
00:27:00,870 --> 00:26:58,799
brings a fresh take on the ufo question

557
00:27:03,269 --> 00:27:00,880
he certainly has the connections to

558
00:27:05,990 --> 00:27:03,279
bring the right voices to the screen and

559
00:27:08,630 --> 00:27:06,000
he never hesitates on asking real

560
00:27:11,269 --> 00:27:08,640
questions he definitely lays it out

561
00:27:13,750 --> 00:27:11,279
there uh here in the states but it's

562
00:27:15,750 --> 00:27:13,760
ex-mouth on the west coast of australia

563
00:27:17,669 --> 00:27:15,760
that really needs your attention

564
00:27:20,070 --> 00:27:17,679
now without spoiling anything here

565
00:27:22,310 --> 00:27:20,080
you've got to check out in plain sight

566
00:27:25,190 --> 00:27:22,320
it's very well done

567
00:27:28,230 --> 00:27:25,200
which leaves us with show times ufo by

568
00:27:30,389 --> 00:27:28,240
jj abrams and at the bottom of the hour

569
00:27:32,789 --> 00:27:30,399
in just a few minutes richard dolan will

570
00:27:34,470 --> 00:27:32,799
join us for a full review and analysis

571
00:27:36,310 --> 00:27:34,480
but before he gets here i want to say a

572
00:27:37,350 --> 00:27:36,320
few things got to point some stuff out

573
00:27:40,070 --> 00:27:37,360
first

574
00:27:43,110 --> 00:27:40,080
i immediately reached out to all of the

575
00:27:44,870 --> 00:27:43,120
main players in ufo to get them to come

576
00:27:46,950 --> 00:27:44,880
on the show and have a conversation now

577
00:27:50,149 --> 00:27:46,960
without naming any names

578
00:27:51,669 --> 00:27:50,159
all declined for their own reasons which

579
00:27:54,389 --> 00:27:51,679
is very strange

580
00:27:56,630 --> 00:27:54,399
two agreed but one couldn't do to a

581
00:27:58,870 --> 00:27:56,640
scheduling conflict and the second

582
00:28:01,430 --> 00:27:58,880
just changed their mind

583
00:28:03,590 --> 00:28:01,440
the total was seven i reached out to

584
00:28:05,590 --> 00:28:03,600
seven that's right seven now without

585
00:28:07,110 --> 00:28:05,600
jumping to some of the crazy conspiracy

586
00:28:09,190 --> 00:28:07,120
theories that have been bouncing through

587
00:28:12,389 --> 00:28:09,200
my head and yes i've asked myself what

588
00:28:14,710 --> 00:28:12,399
might be going on let's just get to go

589
00:28:16,950 --> 00:28:14,720
with the reality which is everybody

590
00:28:19,510 --> 00:28:16,960
declined for their own reasons and none

591
00:28:20,789 --> 00:28:19,520
of them were the same

592
00:28:23,269 --> 00:28:20,799
coincidence

593
00:28:24,870 --> 00:28:23,279
i have no idea but rather than fight the

594
00:28:26,950 --> 00:28:24,880
current of the river

595
00:28:28,789 --> 00:28:26,960
i called up dolan and told him what was

596
00:28:30,950 --> 00:28:28,799
going on this was yesterday and yeah he

597
00:28:33,430 --> 00:28:30,960
found it pretty strange as well and then

598
00:28:36,070 --> 00:28:33,440
we decided that we would go on the air

599
00:28:39,750 --> 00:28:36,080
tonight and do our own version of siskel

600
00:28:43,269 --> 00:28:39,760
and ebert we will review and analyze ufo

601
00:28:46,230 --> 00:28:43,279
on our own now about the series

602
00:28:48,149 --> 00:28:46,240
after watching episode one i posted it

603
00:28:50,710 --> 00:28:48,159
on social media for everyone to check

604
00:28:52,470 --> 00:28:50,720
out showtime put up a full episode on

605
00:28:53,190 --> 00:28:52,480
their own youtube channel and yeah for

606
00:28:59,830 --> 00:28:53,200
the

607
00:29:01,830 --> 00:28:59,840
dang good and i very rarely am happy

608
00:29:04,470 --> 00:29:01,840
with any ufo programming it's just the

609
00:29:06,710 --> 00:29:04,480
way that it is but this made me jump and

610
00:29:09,909 --> 00:29:06,720
post it up for the world to see and then

611
00:29:13,269 --> 00:29:09,919
i watched the rest of the series i was

612
00:29:15,350 --> 00:29:13,279
sent all of this series uh all files for

613
00:29:17,990 --> 00:29:15,360
each episode it's got watermarks in it

614
00:29:20,630 --> 00:29:18,000
but i had that in advance and i also had

615
00:29:22,630 --> 00:29:20,640
the showtime app on amazon so

616
00:29:23,510 --> 00:29:22,640
i watched everything

617
00:29:25,669 --> 00:29:23,520
twice

618
00:29:27,669 --> 00:29:25,679
that's right i had to

619
00:29:29,909 --> 00:29:27,679
let me explain

620
00:29:32,389 --> 00:29:29,919
after the first episode finished dolan

621
00:29:34,470 --> 00:29:32,399
and i will discuss this in a few minutes

622
00:29:37,190 --> 00:29:34,480
i felt that this was definitely going

623
00:29:39,990 --> 00:29:37,200
straight for the et issue the ufo

624
00:29:42,630 --> 00:29:40,000
question and by the time uh episode

625
00:29:44,789 --> 00:29:42,640
three finished i realized that things

626
00:29:47,510 --> 00:29:44,799
completely flip-flopped

627
00:29:50,070 --> 00:29:47,520
that jj was taking things for a hard

628
00:29:51,510 --> 00:29:50,080
left or right turn take your pick it

629
00:29:53,430 --> 00:29:51,520
doesn't matter but

630
00:29:54,470 --> 00:29:53,440
but things just got very very

631
00:29:56,470 --> 00:29:54,480
interesting

632
00:29:58,789 --> 00:29:56,480
now richard and i will go all

633
00:30:00,549 --> 00:29:58,799
into this in depth but there seems to be

634
00:30:03,110 --> 00:30:00,559
from where i sit

635
00:30:06,070 --> 00:30:03,120
there seems to be some very clever

636
00:30:09,110 --> 00:30:06,080
editing going on in that

637
00:30:10,789 --> 00:30:09,120
i'm not entirely sure if what is on the

638
00:30:14,950 --> 00:30:10,799
screen

639
00:30:17,350 --> 00:30:14,960
is actually what was said or intended

640
00:30:19,669 --> 00:30:17,360
now i don't know this is fact i mean i

641
00:30:20,870 --> 00:30:19,679
know everybody here except for james

642
00:30:23,750 --> 00:30:20,880
carrion

643
00:30:26,549 --> 00:30:23,760
and i pretty much know how they fall

644
00:30:29,669 --> 00:30:26,559
with the e.t ufo question

645
00:30:31,909 --> 00:30:29,679
and things seem a little bit twisted so

646
00:30:34,789 --> 00:30:31,919
i went back and watched everything again

647
00:30:37,350 --> 00:30:34,799
now to be clear i've either spoken to or

648
00:30:39,269 --> 00:30:37,360
have been in touch with everybody in the

649
00:30:42,389 --> 00:30:39,279
series over the weekend except for james

650
00:30:44,389 --> 00:30:42,399
carrion and and george knapp by the way

651
00:30:46,870 --> 00:30:44,399
and we'll see over the weeks and months

652
00:30:50,230 --> 00:30:46,880
ahead how they all feel about how they

653
00:30:52,710 --> 00:30:50,240
were represented here on ufo okay i

654
00:30:53,510 --> 00:30:52,720
don't know and of course you need to see

655
00:30:58,230 --> 00:30:53,520
it

656
00:31:01,190 --> 00:30:58,240
may be different from mine i don't know

657
00:31:02,630 --> 00:31:01,200
and my mind can change again anyway and

658
00:31:04,549 --> 00:31:02,640
it often does

659
00:31:06,710 --> 00:31:04,559
after i watch it a third and fourth time

660
00:31:09,029 --> 00:31:06,720
which i probably will and i have a

661
00:31:10,710 --> 00:31:09,039
feeling i'm going to be doing just that

662
00:31:13,110 --> 00:31:10,720
probably starting tonight

663
00:31:16,630 --> 00:31:13,120
also i want to mention this

664
00:31:20,389 --> 00:31:16,640
amid the flurry of ufo content

665
00:31:22,870 --> 00:31:20,399
amazon released the documentary val

666
00:31:26,549 --> 00:31:22,880
about val kilmer

667
00:31:28,389 --> 00:31:26,559
and i gotta tell you this is a must

668
00:31:29,830 --> 00:31:28,399
watch for everybody listening to my

669
00:31:32,950 --> 00:31:29,840
voice right now

670
00:31:35,029 --> 00:31:32,960
seriously watch all the ufo content it's

671
00:31:36,389 --> 00:31:35,039
all out there

672
00:31:39,029 --> 00:31:36,399
and it's free

673
00:31:41,669 --> 00:31:39,039
but you've got to watch val and that is

674
00:31:42,789 --> 00:31:41,679
free too as well i am your host jimmy

675
00:31:44,630 --> 00:31:42,799
church

676
00:31:47,509 --> 00:31:44,640
great week coming up here on fade to

677
00:31:51,830 --> 00:31:47,519
black up next is richard dolan

678
00:31:56,789 --> 00:31:53,750
he just texted me i'm going to read it

679
00:31:59,509 --> 00:31:56,799
it says i'm ready sucker

680
00:32:01,509 --> 00:31:59,519
just letting you know that i'm ready man

681
00:32:03,509 --> 00:32:01,519
richard i can't i can't say these words

682
00:32:05,750 --> 00:32:03,519
on the air

683
00:32:08,789 --> 00:32:05,760
it's a family show this is fade to black

684
00:32:13,750 --> 00:32:08,799
i am your host jimmy church

685
00:32:17,830 --> 00:32:15,509
richard dolan's the best he's gonna be

686
00:32:19,669 --> 00:32:17,840
with us right after this short break i

687
00:32:22,470 --> 00:32:19,679
am your host jimmy church on the game

688
00:32:25,580 --> 00:32:22,480
changer network and kgra the planet stay

689
00:32:38,630 --> 00:32:25,590
with us

690
00:32:40,789 --> 00:32:38,640
[Music]

691
00:32:42,950 --> 00:32:40,799
this is nicole church daughter of you

692
00:32:43,950 --> 00:32:42,960
know who and you're listening to fade to

693
00:32:45,590 --> 00:32:43,960
black on

694
00:32:49,350 --> 00:32:45,600
jimmychurchradio.com and the game

695
00:32:56,070 --> 00:32:51,669
you're listening to jimmy church fade to

696
00:32:59,010 --> 00:32:57,990
to black will now pause for alien

697
00:33:00,310 --> 00:32:59,020
identification

698
00:33:02,590 --> 00:33:00,320
[Music]

699
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700
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this is jimmy church of fade to black

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and you can get our podcast for just two

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dollars per month all you have to do is

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729
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hi folks it's trembling times and fear

730
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is pushing emotions which in turn pushes

731
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health the wrong direction do you ever

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life change team may not help with world

738
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issues but it will help with your

739
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digestive issues a glass a day helps

740
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keep the intruders away so

741
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change your life today log on to get the

742
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749
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750
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751
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754
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755
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vader knots when you think about the

756
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future of our country and where we're

757
00:35:35,910 --> 00:35:32,800
headed do you wonder about the food

758
00:35:38,069 --> 00:35:35,920
supply i do disruptions in the food

759
00:35:40,870 --> 00:35:38,079
supply chain could be disastrous and

760
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they usually occur with little warning

761
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that's why the smartest thing you can do

762
00:35:48,870 --> 00:35:45,839
today is to stockpile emergency food

763
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water and other essentials i personally

764
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recommend my patriot supply they're the

765
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nation's largest emergency preparedness

766
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767
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for more than a decade in fact they're

768
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the only source my family trusts for our

769
00:36:07,589 --> 00:36:04,480
preparedness plan you should too

770
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right now save 20 off a full four week

771
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supply of delicious meals that provide 2

772
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000 calories a day saving 20 helps too

773
00:36:19,670 --> 00:36:16,640
doesn't it especially now so go to

774
00:36:22,950 --> 00:36:19,680
prepare with jimmy.com and get ready

775
00:36:27,430 --> 00:36:22,960
that's prepare with jimmy.com there's no

776
00:36:32,550 --> 00:36:27,440
time to lose do it now

777
00:36:36,310 --> 00:36:34,950
fade to black

778
00:36:38,950 --> 00:36:36,320
is not

779
00:36:41,910 --> 00:36:38,960
your father's radio show

780
00:36:43,510 --> 00:36:41,920
on the game changer radio network and

781
00:36:46,230 --> 00:36:43,520
kgra

782
00:36:48,230 --> 00:36:46,240
the planet

783
00:36:52,870 --> 00:36:48,240
hi this is rob reiner from anvil and

784
00:36:59,000 --> 00:36:55,750
what's up i'm chris what up this is

785
00:37:13,589 --> 00:36:59,010
jimmy church radio

786
00:37:18,150 --> 00:37:15,349
all right welcome back fade to black i

787
00:37:21,270 --> 00:37:18,160
am your host jimmy church

788
00:37:22,550 --> 00:37:21,280
whoo man tonight richard dolan is here

789
00:37:25,670 --> 00:37:22,560
now we're going to be

790
00:37:28,230 --> 00:37:25,680
uh doing a full analysis on showtime's

791
00:37:30,470 --> 00:37:28,240
ufo by j.j abrams i want to remind

792
00:37:32,310 --> 00:37:30,480
everybody about the week that we've got

793
00:37:34,150 --> 00:37:32,320
coming up tomorrow night stephen bassett

794
00:37:36,310 --> 00:37:34,160
is here we're going to be talking about

795
00:37:39,030 --> 00:37:36,320
the new netflix series secret ufo

796
00:37:42,069 --> 00:37:39,040
projects uh featuring stephen and then

797
00:37:43,910 --> 00:37:42,079
wednesday night dr robert m shock and we

798
00:37:45,670 --> 00:37:43,920
are going to talk about the new revised

799
00:37:47,589 --> 00:37:45,680
and updated edition

800
00:37:49,910 --> 00:37:47,599
and release of his book forgotten

801
00:37:51,990 --> 00:37:49,920
civilization and then thursday night of

802
00:37:54,230 --> 00:37:52,000
course is fader night with open lines

803
00:37:56,630 --> 00:37:54,240
all night long tonight it's richard

804
00:37:59,030 --> 00:37:56,640
and i'm just gonna say richard uh i've

805
00:38:00,150 --> 00:37:59,040
got him muted right now i don't need him

806
00:38:02,310 --> 00:38:00,160
on the air

807
00:38:03,910 --> 00:38:02,320
because richard has lost his mind he's

808
00:38:05,990 --> 00:38:03,920
officially

809
00:38:08,150 --> 00:38:06,000
it's it's not coming back everybody it's

810
00:38:12,790 --> 00:38:08,160
just not and he's laughing he's wearing

811
00:38:16,069 --> 00:38:12,800
a hawaiian shirt he looks very relaxed

812
00:38:18,710 --> 00:38:16,079
and uh yes yes yes very cool richard

813
00:38:20,630 --> 00:38:18,720
okay let's let's get straight to it

814
00:38:23,270 --> 00:38:20,640
um richard is one of the leading

815
00:38:26,470 --> 00:38:23,280
researchers a good friend of the show

816
00:38:28,870 --> 00:38:26,480
uh we hang out and trade ideas and argue

817
00:38:32,150 --> 00:38:28,880
quite a bit it's how we progress in this

818
00:38:34,310 --> 00:38:32,160
world and we are going to be doing that

819
00:38:37,270 --> 00:38:34,320
tonight on the show and i i've called

820
00:38:39,109 --> 00:38:37,280
this uh our version of siskel and ebert

821
00:38:41,430 --> 00:38:39,119
and let's see if we can have a clash of

822
00:38:43,349 --> 00:38:41,440
the minds of course he completed all of

823
00:38:46,710 --> 00:38:43,359
his graduate work at the university of

824
00:38:49,109 --> 00:38:46,720
rochester uh studied a u.s cold war

825
00:38:53,349 --> 00:38:49,119
strategy european history international

826
00:38:55,349 --> 00:38:53,359
diplomacy he is a historian he also

827
00:38:56,950 --> 00:38:55,359
hosts his own weekly radio show the

828
00:39:00,990 --> 00:38:56,960
richard dolan show

829
00:39:03,670 --> 00:39:01,000
everything dolan is over at richard

830
00:39:07,109 --> 00:39:03,680
dolanmembers.com i'm featured there

831
00:39:09,109 --> 00:39:07,119
so go over join richard dolanmembers.com

832
00:39:11,510 --> 00:39:09,119
and then you get the double dose of

833
00:39:13,589 --> 00:39:11,520
jimmy and richard and that's all

834
00:39:16,310 --> 00:39:13,599
featured over there richard welcome back

835
00:39:18,390 --> 00:39:16,320
to the show my man how you doing hi mr

836
00:39:20,710 --> 00:39:18,400
jimmy it's a pleasure

837
00:39:23,030 --> 00:39:20,720
you've lost your mind man

838
00:39:24,790 --> 00:39:23,040
you've lost your mom's shirt

839
00:39:26,870 --> 00:39:24,800
i was looking at you on video and i

840
00:39:30,390 --> 00:39:26,880
thought you're smoking weed

841
00:39:36,150 --> 00:39:32,150
i don't believe that for an instant yeah

842
00:39:38,150 --> 00:39:36,160
it's uh it's uh it's heroin richard it's

843
00:39:39,750 --> 00:39:38,160
i knew it yeah something like that it

844
00:39:42,630 --> 00:39:39,760
you know weed

845
00:39:44,470 --> 00:39:42,640
heroin and this show opiates

846
00:39:46,790 --> 00:39:44,480
that is one thing

847
00:39:49,510 --> 00:39:46,800
weed and this show that would be like

848
00:39:51,109 --> 00:39:49,520
the worst broadcast ever i could only

849
00:39:52,870 --> 00:39:51,119
say it's bad for you but look at you it

850
00:39:54,630 --> 00:39:52,880
helps you out it's obviously not a bad

851
00:39:56,710 --> 00:39:54,640
thing it's it no

852
00:39:59,430 --> 00:39:56,720
it's it's how you do it

853
00:40:02,069 --> 00:39:59,440
that's exactly it worked well for jimmy

854
00:40:03,670 --> 00:40:02,079
page that's all i got to say man

855
00:40:07,190 --> 00:40:03,680
there would have been no stairway to

856
00:40:13,670 --> 00:40:11,990
oh man now uh okay let's get the format

857
00:40:15,349 --> 00:40:13,680
formalities out of the way what was the

858
00:40:17,349 --> 00:40:15,359
last song you listened to today so we

859
00:40:19,589 --> 00:40:17,359
can move on i knew you're gonna ask me

860
00:40:21,510 --> 00:40:19,599
that and um this was an easy one because

861
00:40:22,390 --> 00:40:21,520
i've been on this kick for the last two

862
00:40:25,190 --> 00:40:22,400
weeks

863
00:40:26,470 --> 00:40:25,200
i've been listening to 1940s swing jazz

864
00:40:29,829 --> 00:40:26,480
oh

865
00:40:31,589 --> 00:40:29,839
greatest stuff

866
00:40:32,710 --> 00:40:31,599
i've always loved it uh benny good

867
00:40:34,309 --> 00:40:32,720
letting you go in and out of certain

868
00:40:36,550 --> 00:40:34,319
things right benny good i don't know

869
00:40:38,309 --> 00:40:36,560
what it was so i listened to a song just

870
00:40:39,750 --> 00:40:38,319
a little while ago one of my favorites

871
00:40:43,030 --> 00:40:39,760
uh there's a lot of great ones this

872
00:40:45,750 --> 00:40:43,040
one's by count basies orchestra

873
00:40:48,309 --> 00:40:45,760
and the song is jumping at the woodside

874
00:40:50,870 --> 00:40:48,319
and i will challenge the listeners of us

875
00:40:51,990 --> 00:40:50,880
this show during a break is going to cut

876
00:40:53,270 --> 00:40:52,000
into your commercials you're going to

877
00:40:55,270 --> 00:40:53,280
lose money here church but i'm just

878
00:40:57,270 --> 00:40:55,280
going to say people should find jumping

879
00:40:59,430 --> 00:40:57,280
at the woodside check it out and the

880
00:41:01,270 --> 00:40:59,440
challenge is listen to it and don't move

881
00:41:04,790 --> 00:41:01,280
your body like that's impossible because

882
00:41:09,190 --> 00:41:04,800
it's just too good um there is uh

883
00:41:10,790 --> 00:41:09,200
there's a a really great scene um in

884
00:41:12,470 --> 00:41:10,800
uh

885
00:41:13,910 --> 00:41:12,480
mel brooks

886
00:41:18,150 --> 00:41:13,920
um

887
00:41:19,109 --> 00:41:18,160
i'm trying to think exactly how it was

888
00:41:22,630 --> 00:41:19,119
done

889
00:41:23,589 --> 00:41:22,640
but um uh oh man now i'm brain uh

890
00:41:24,470 --> 00:41:23,599
farting

891
00:41:28,790 --> 00:41:24,480
uh

892
00:41:29,990 --> 00:41:28,800
see that's why you don't do it live on

893
00:41:30,790 --> 00:41:30,000
the air

894
00:41:35,190 --> 00:41:30,800
uh

895
00:41:36,870 --> 00:41:35,200
1972 the western blazing saddles so

896
00:41:38,870 --> 00:41:36,880
and there's this famous scene they're

897
00:41:40,950 --> 00:41:38,880
out in the desert they shot it in like

898
00:41:42,309 --> 00:41:40,960
chatsworth california

899
00:41:43,670 --> 00:41:42,319
and uh

900
00:41:45,910 --> 00:41:43,680
and the sheriff is you know they're

901
00:41:48,470 --> 00:41:45,920
rolling through and they come up on

902
00:41:49,750 --> 00:41:48,480
count basie's orchestra and they're set

903
00:41:50,950 --> 00:41:49,760
up i don't remember that yeah yeah

904
00:41:53,510 --> 00:41:50,960
they're set up in the middle of the

905
00:41:55,270 --> 00:41:53,520
desert and there's seriously basics

906
00:41:57,349 --> 00:41:55,280
orchestra yeah yeah yeah

907
00:41:59,510 --> 00:41:57,359
in the middle of the desert and it makes

908
00:42:02,309 --> 00:41:59,520
absolutely no sense

909
00:42:04,309 --> 00:42:02,319
of course it's a hilarious scene and

910
00:42:05,750 --> 00:42:04,319
it's count basie and his orchestra

911
00:42:07,510 --> 00:42:05,760
playing swing

912
00:42:09,829 --> 00:42:07,520
in the middle of the desert in

913
00:42:11,109 --> 00:42:09,839
chatsworth california so there you go

914
00:42:12,069 --> 00:42:11,119
i love it i'm just going to say this one

915
00:42:13,910 --> 00:42:12,079
last thing and then we're going to get

916
00:42:15,030 --> 00:42:13,920
into ufos people think why talk about

917
00:42:16,710 --> 00:42:15,040
music when you're supposed to be talking

918
00:42:19,670 --> 00:42:16,720
about ufos but this is what i've

919
00:42:22,150 --> 00:42:19,680
realized about the swing era

920
00:42:24,550 --> 00:42:22,160
in music history it's like

921
00:42:26,710 --> 00:42:24,560
i mean the 1930s and 40s are so far

922
00:42:28,309 --> 00:42:26,720
removed from us now like if anyone

923
00:42:30,390 --> 00:42:28,319
remembers that period they've got to be

924
00:42:32,710 --> 00:42:30,400
in their 80s or 90s and they were little

925
00:42:34,470 --> 00:42:32,720
kids right so it's basically gone from

926
00:42:36,069 --> 00:42:34,480
us and it really only exists in books

927
00:42:37,990 --> 00:42:36,079
and digitally and all of that

928
00:42:39,589 --> 00:42:38,000
but when you

929
00:42:41,510 --> 00:42:39,599
i think we have enough distance from it

930
00:42:42,550 --> 00:42:41,520
now in here we're well into the 21st

931
00:42:44,950 --> 00:42:42,560
century

932
00:42:47,430 --> 00:42:44,960
you listen to that music

933
00:42:49,030 --> 00:42:47,440
like it's happy music and and this is

934
00:42:51,510 --> 00:42:49,040
music that was like during the great

935
00:42:53,430 --> 00:42:51,520
depression in world war ii like massive

936
00:42:56,550 --> 00:42:53,440
difficulty and struggle and yet the

937
00:42:59,109 --> 00:42:56,560
music there's this vitality this

938
00:43:01,670 --> 00:42:59,119
optimism this happiness it's really an

939
00:43:04,230 --> 00:43:01,680
amazing thing so you really like these

940
00:43:05,990 --> 00:43:04,240
are strong people and happy people and

941
00:43:07,589 --> 00:43:06,000
they love to dance like you can just see

942
00:43:08,790 --> 00:43:07,599
it and all of that so yeah basically

943
00:43:11,670 --> 00:43:08,800
jumping at the wood side but there's

944
00:43:13,750 --> 00:43:11,680
just so many of those great songs

945
00:43:15,430 --> 00:43:13,760
that just well that's the word they use

946
00:43:16,069 --> 00:43:15,440
for it they swing

947
00:43:19,910 --> 00:43:16,079
and

948
00:43:21,510 --> 00:43:19,920
conservative you weren't supposed to get

949
00:43:24,790 --> 00:43:21,520
up out of your seats you were supposed

950
00:43:26,630 --> 00:43:24,800
to be polite and and do this well i

951
00:43:27,990 --> 00:43:26,640
don't know about that actually i think

952
00:43:29,510 --> 00:43:28,000
but but this is

953
00:43:32,309 --> 00:43:29,520
this is what happened this was the

954
00:43:35,670 --> 00:43:32,319
controversy and everybody young ones you

955
00:43:40,710 --> 00:43:37,349
benny goodman

956
00:43:44,309 --> 00:43:40,720
plays carnegie hall and

957
00:43:46,550 --> 00:43:44,319
and he had his uh famous hit song and

958
00:43:49,109 --> 00:43:46,560
and um it's called sing sing sing

959
00:43:52,230 --> 00:43:49,119
but great song great great song but so

960
00:43:54,710 --> 00:43:52,240
he plays carnegie hall the headline

961
00:43:55,589 --> 00:43:54,720
on the for the new york times the next

962
00:43:56,710 --> 00:43:55,599
day

963
00:43:58,950 --> 00:43:56,720
was

964
00:44:02,470 --> 00:43:58,960
benny goodman had him dancing in the

965
00:44:04,710 --> 00:44:02,480
aisles at carnegie hall oh wow it was

966
00:44:06,870 --> 00:44:04,720
yeah it was the first and they the music

967
00:44:09,190 --> 00:44:06,880
was so happy like you're saying it was

968
00:44:11,589 --> 00:44:09,200
so infectious that everybody just lost

969
00:44:13,030 --> 00:44:11,599
control of themselves and they got it

970
00:44:15,190 --> 00:44:13,040
that's impossible

971
00:44:18,069 --> 00:44:15,200
and he was such a master clarinet player

972
00:44:20,550 --> 00:44:18,079
he was so amazing and it was incredible

973
00:44:22,630 --> 00:44:20,560
that's right he had gene krupa on drums

974
00:44:26,630 --> 00:44:22,640
the greatest original keith moon the

975
00:44:29,829 --> 00:44:26,640
original keith moon who who gene krupa

976
00:44:31,510 --> 00:44:29,839
was the first guy arrested

977
00:44:34,230 --> 00:44:31,520
for pot

978
00:44:37,190 --> 00:44:34,240
oh really yes gene krupa

979
00:44:38,950 --> 00:44:37,200
smoking life like the first person look

980
00:44:41,270 --> 00:44:38,960
it up

981
00:44:44,470 --> 00:44:41,280
good god yeah gene krupa man went to

982
00:44:46,309 --> 00:44:44,480
jail for the mary jane for the marriage

983
00:44:49,990 --> 00:44:46,319
he was like the first really monster

984
00:44:51,910 --> 00:44:50,000
drummer like ever drunk i mean

985
00:44:53,510 --> 00:44:51,920
he like became

986
00:44:56,550 --> 00:44:53,520
and then right after him was buddy rich

987
00:44:58,150 --> 00:44:56,560
but but krupa was like this amazing he

988
00:45:00,470 --> 00:44:58,160
was so good

989
00:45:01,430 --> 00:45:00,480
uh he just became like the center of of

990
00:45:03,589 --> 00:45:01,440
um

991
00:45:05,270 --> 00:45:03,599
of the songs and he he was kind of like

992
00:45:08,309 --> 00:45:05,280
a wild keith moon type of a drummer

993
00:45:11,270 --> 00:45:08,319
absolutely he did you know drum solos

994
00:45:15,270 --> 00:45:11,280
right there wouldn't be a john bonham a

995
00:45:16,870 --> 00:45:15,280
drum solo uh you know for uh let's have

996
00:45:21,030 --> 00:45:16,880
a look if there wasn't for

997
00:45:25,829 --> 00:45:23,349
total badass all of those guys

998
00:45:27,589 --> 00:45:25,839
and the singers you know listen to basie

999
00:45:29,030 --> 00:45:27,599
but billy holliday sang was basie she

1000
00:45:29,990 --> 00:45:29,040
was just divine

1001
00:45:32,390 --> 00:45:30,000
ella

1002
00:45:35,030 --> 00:45:32,400
uh someone uh a lot of people forget uh

1003
00:45:36,630 --> 00:45:35,040
anita o'day who was just another amazing

1004
00:45:37,990 --> 00:45:36,640
singer of the forge just so many and

1005
00:45:40,069 --> 00:45:38,000
sinatra and

1006
00:45:41,750 --> 00:45:40,079
so many others so it was just a great

1007
00:45:42,950 --> 00:45:41,760
time so anyway i've been on this little

1008
00:45:44,870 --> 00:45:42,960
kick for the last couple of weeks and

1009
00:45:46,790 --> 00:45:44,880
i'm still into it there you go and

1010
00:45:48,870 --> 00:45:46,800
you're putting on your retro baseball

1011
00:45:50,630 --> 00:45:48,880
uniform uh when you're listening to it

1012
00:45:52,230 --> 00:45:50,640
too as well and running around the house

1013
00:45:54,069 --> 00:45:52,240
talk about this on your show before yeah

1014
00:45:56,150 --> 00:45:54,079
we did we did we did

1015
00:45:57,510 --> 00:45:56,160
i just uh i just needed that quick

1016
00:46:00,470 --> 00:45:57,520
visual

1017
00:46:03,109 --> 00:46:00,480
uh okay richard very

1018
00:46:04,550 --> 00:46:03,119
very big week and when i was i was

1019
00:46:07,510 --> 00:46:04,560
talking about

1020
00:46:08,710 --> 00:46:07,520
uh last week uh at the beginning of the

1021
00:46:11,829 --> 00:46:08,720
week how

1022
00:46:14,870 --> 00:46:11,839
ufos have dropped off the radar of mass

1023
00:46:17,430 --> 00:46:14,880
media you know uh you know tucker's gone

1024
00:46:19,109 --> 00:46:17,440
silent what's going on here

1025
00:46:21,109 --> 00:46:19,119
and i'm not the only one talking about

1026
00:46:24,470 --> 00:46:21,119
it you know people have noticed this

1027
00:46:27,990 --> 00:46:24,480
this strange downturn and then boom in

1028
00:46:30,230 --> 00:46:28,000
the same week we get ross culthart the

1029
00:46:33,190 --> 00:46:30,240
release of his documentary in plain

1030
00:46:35,270 --> 00:46:33,200
sight finally channel 7 out of australia

1031
00:46:37,750 --> 00:46:35,280
has released that worldwide it's an

1032
00:46:40,630 --> 00:46:37,760
incredible documentary that happened

1033
00:46:44,710 --> 00:46:40,640
netflix comes out uh with their six-part

1034
00:46:47,829 --> 00:46:44,720
docu-series ufo secret projects and then

1035
00:46:50,630 --> 00:46:47,839
of course the much anticipated ufo on

1036
00:46:54,230 --> 00:46:50,640
showtime by j.j abrams

1037
00:46:56,630 --> 00:46:54,240
heck of a weekend of of ufo content out

1038
00:46:57,670 --> 00:46:56,640
there how much of it did you get a

1039
00:46:59,349 --> 00:46:57,680
chance

1040
00:47:01,910 --> 00:46:59,359
it's too much to why

1041
00:47:05,030 --> 00:47:01,920
no i haven't look i've only seen uh the

1042
00:47:08,150 --> 00:47:05,040
jj abrams up to now so coldheart's work

1043
00:47:10,150 --> 00:47:08,160
is absolutely on my list and i've i've

1044
00:47:12,309 --> 00:47:10,160
never spoken him but i i know a lot of

1045
00:47:15,349 --> 00:47:12,319
i've had a lot of intermediaries

1046
00:47:16,950 --> 00:47:15,359
uh and i know exactly like just how

1047
00:47:19,190 --> 00:47:16,960
great his work is i'm very much looking

1048
00:47:21,190 --> 00:47:19,200
forward to diving into him

1049
00:47:23,349 --> 00:47:21,200
and uh the netflix thing i think i'm in

1050
00:47:26,950 --> 00:47:23,359
one of those uh yeah

1051
00:47:29,270 --> 00:47:26,960
but i didn't really look it was uh i'll

1052
00:47:31,910 --> 00:47:29,280
remind you you may not even remember

1053
00:47:33,990 --> 00:47:31,920
this was filmed at the international ufo

1054
00:47:36,230 --> 00:47:34,000
congress uh three years ago the people

1055
00:47:38,230 --> 00:47:36,240
from czechoslovakia yep yep yep yeah

1056
00:47:40,710 --> 00:47:38,240
okay i do remember them yeah so

1057
00:47:42,950 --> 00:47:40,720
everybody at the conferences

1058
00:47:45,510 --> 00:47:42,960
is featured in uh this six-part uh

1059
00:47:48,470 --> 00:47:45,520
documentary okay that that makes sense

1060
00:47:49,589 --> 00:47:48,480
okay so that's what that is um they went

1061
00:47:53,109 --> 00:47:49,599
back

1062
00:47:55,430 --> 00:47:53,119
and did a lot of post uh work on this a

1063
00:47:57,270 --> 00:47:55,440
lot of recreations and animations it's

1064
00:48:01,109 --> 00:47:57,280
actually pretty well done

1065
00:48:02,870 --> 00:48:01,119
but um my if i have a critique of it

1066
00:48:05,190 --> 00:48:02,880
what they didn't do

1067
00:48:07,750 --> 00:48:05,200
but it's kind of cool that they forgot

1068
00:48:10,470 --> 00:48:07,760
to do this they didn't do any updates

1069
00:48:13,510 --> 00:48:10,480
so it's a time capsule of everybody's

1070
00:48:15,589 --> 00:48:13,520
mindset of three years ago right no

1071
00:48:18,470 --> 00:48:15,599
follow-up on on current events or

1072
00:48:21,750 --> 00:48:18,480
anything like that um so it's a very

1073
00:48:23,990 --> 00:48:21,760
without that it's actually pretty cool

1074
00:48:27,349 --> 00:48:24,000
to see where everybody was three years

1075
00:48:32,150 --> 00:48:27,359
ago versus where we are today three or

1076
00:48:36,950 --> 00:48:32,160
two 2018 then um it's worth 2019 uh

1077
00:48:39,190 --> 00:48:36,960
well it's you it's mary rodwell um

1078
00:48:41,109 --> 00:48:39,200
uh let me

1079
00:48:43,030 --> 00:48:41,119
uh it doesn't matter we'll figure that

1080
00:48:46,390 --> 00:48:43,040
out later yeah yeah yeah i need to

1081
00:48:50,069 --> 00:48:46,400
quibble over that so uh alejandro's in

1082
00:48:52,230 --> 00:48:50,079
it too as well so that may give you a

1083
00:48:53,510 --> 00:48:52,240
little bit of this but let's uh let's

1084
00:48:57,829 --> 00:48:53,520
get to the

1085
00:49:01,510 --> 00:48:57,839
the matter

1086
00:49:05,589 --> 00:49:01,520
which is ufo by jj abrams

1087
00:49:07,349 --> 00:49:05,599
um my fur my first comments if i'm going

1088
00:49:09,910 --> 00:49:07,359
to have comments

1089
00:49:11,829 --> 00:49:09,920
uh to open this up i would like your

1090
00:49:16,069 --> 00:49:11,839
follow-up on what i'm about to say which

1091
00:49:17,829 --> 00:49:16,079
is sure high expectations it's jj abrams

1092
00:49:19,990 --> 00:49:17,839
so you know

1093
00:49:22,069 --> 00:49:20,000
that it's going to have production value

1094
00:49:24,390 --> 00:49:22,079
it's going to be edited correctly the

1095
00:49:26,630 --> 00:49:24,400
sound is going to be correct uh the the

1096
00:49:29,510 --> 00:49:26,640
music is going to be correct

1097
00:49:33,030 --> 00:49:29,520
um the visuals and cinematography and

1098
00:49:36,069 --> 00:49:33,040
the dp are all going to be top shelf

1099
00:49:39,910 --> 00:49:36,079
so you go into that expecting that i got

1100
00:49:41,510 --> 00:49:39,920
all of that for sure your comments

1101
00:49:43,750 --> 00:49:41,520
oh yes well i agree completely and

1102
00:49:45,990 --> 00:49:43,760
everything that you've just said so

1103
00:49:47,190 --> 00:49:46,000
it was very well produced

1104
00:49:50,069 --> 00:49:47,200
now

1105
00:49:52,150 --> 00:49:50,079
the first episode is freely available on

1106
00:49:54,710 --> 00:49:52,160
the showtime youtube channel

1107
00:49:57,750 --> 00:49:54,720
you were kind enough to allow me to have

1108
00:49:59,589 --> 00:49:57,760
access to the other three episodes

1109
00:50:02,390 --> 00:49:59,599
and i will tell you that i

1110
00:50:04,470 --> 00:50:02,400
saw two of the three come in completion

1111
00:50:06,470 --> 00:50:04,480
and just kind of scrub through uh one of

1112
00:50:07,589 --> 00:50:06,480
the others so i have a pretty good

1113
00:50:09,990 --> 00:50:07,599
handle on

1114
00:50:11,829 --> 00:50:10,000
all of them uh episode two i kind of

1115
00:50:13,030 --> 00:50:11,839
blew through pretty fast that one was

1116
00:50:15,270 --> 00:50:13,040
pretty good though

1117
00:50:16,790 --> 00:50:15,280
um overall i would say that the first

1118
00:50:18,950 --> 00:50:16,800
episode which is

1119
00:50:20,390 --> 00:50:18,960
fully available to everyone

1120
00:50:24,870 --> 00:50:20,400
was quite good

1121
00:50:27,349 --> 00:50:24,880
i have i have a real problem with one of

1122
00:50:28,950 --> 00:50:27,359
the episodes uh we'll get to you know

1123
00:50:30,790 --> 00:50:28,960
what we'll talk about yeah we'll get to

1124
00:50:33,990 --> 00:50:30,800
all of that um

1125
00:50:37,990 --> 00:50:34,000
as as as tonight rolls along but let's

1126
00:50:38,870 --> 00:50:38,000
uh let's talk about um episode one

1127
00:50:41,030 --> 00:50:38,880
and

1128
00:50:44,549 --> 00:50:41,040
my uh

1129
00:50:45,589 --> 00:50:44,559
i i do want to go deep into this because

1130
00:50:48,630 --> 00:50:45,599
it was

1131
00:50:50,470 --> 00:50:48,640
so well done for me and i am very

1132
00:50:52,790 --> 00:50:50,480
critical of when it comes to ufo

1133
00:50:56,630 --> 00:50:52,800
programming i just am right i

1134
00:50:58,309 --> 00:50:56,640
i am i've seen it i've seen everything

1135
00:51:01,510 --> 00:50:58,319
but um

1136
00:51:03,109 --> 00:51:01,520
i not only did i learn stuff in this

1137
00:51:06,549 --> 00:51:03,119
first episode

1138
00:51:08,870 --> 00:51:06,559
but i thought that the approach

1139
00:51:10,309 --> 00:51:08,880
from the writers and the producers and

1140
00:51:12,870 --> 00:51:10,319
jj

1141
00:51:15,190 --> 00:51:12,880
was setting the tone for what was to

1142
00:51:16,230 --> 00:51:15,200
follow in the next three episodes

1143
00:51:18,390 --> 00:51:16,240
and

1144
00:51:20,549 --> 00:51:18,400
i had my hopes up for that but that

1145
00:51:23,589 --> 00:51:20,559
doesn't take away from

1146
00:51:25,990 --> 00:51:23,599
the excellence of the first episode and

1147
00:51:28,710 --> 00:51:26,000
what they chose to cover

1148
00:51:31,349 --> 00:51:28,720
and how they chose to cover it i learned

1149
00:51:33,109 --> 00:51:31,359
a lot about uh the phoenix lights that i

1150
00:51:34,470 --> 00:51:33,119
never knew before and i've covered this

1151
00:51:36,390 --> 00:51:34,480
so much

1152
00:51:37,510 --> 00:51:36,400
that i didn't think there was anything

1153
00:51:40,470 --> 00:51:37,520
new there

1154
00:51:43,190 --> 00:51:40,480
they obviously did their homework

1155
00:51:46,069 --> 00:51:43,200
um i want to talk about that first were

1156
00:51:49,190 --> 00:51:46,079
you surprised that they chose the

1157
00:51:51,589 --> 00:51:49,200
phoenix lights to to do the deep dive

1158
00:51:53,589 --> 00:51:51,599
yes i guess i was now that you mention

1159
00:51:55,030 --> 00:51:53,599
it and like you there were things i

1160
00:51:55,750 --> 00:51:55,040
learned as well

1161
00:52:01,750 --> 00:51:55,760
i

1162
00:52:04,870 --> 00:52:01,760
was not true because there was some

1163
00:52:07,510 --> 00:52:04,880
significant new data points about that

1164
00:52:09,670 --> 00:52:07,520
amazing case that's 1997 of course

1165
00:52:12,230 --> 00:52:09,680
uh when the like the entire city of

1166
00:52:13,349 --> 00:52:12,240
phoenix and much of the state of arizona

1167
00:52:16,069 --> 00:52:13,359
reported

1168
00:52:18,470 --> 00:52:16,079
uh just an incredible incredible aerial

1169
00:52:20,390 --> 00:52:18,480
display you know over their heads

1170
00:52:21,750 --> 00:52:20,400
so um yeah there were some interesting a

1171
00:52:23,190 --> 00:52:21,760
lot of witnesses were brought out of

1172
00:52:25,910 --> 00:52:23,200
course we've known about witnesses for a

1173
00:52:28,069 --> 00:52:25,920
while i was very glad that they focused

1174
00:52:30,549 --> 00:52:28,079
a lot on francis barwood

1175
00:52:33,349 --> 00:52:30,559
who was the city one of the city council

1176
00:52:34,470 --> 00:52:33,359
members of phoenix at that time and the

1177
00:52:36,230 --> 00:52:34,480
only

1178
00:52:38,470 --> 00:52:36,240
member of the phoenix city government at

1179
00:52:39,349 --> 00:52:38,480
all who had the courage

1180
00:52:41,670 --> 00:52:39,359
to

1181
00:52:43,510 --> 00:52:41,680
take on this case and man she got

1182
00:52:45,750 --> 00:52:43,520
roasted you know

1183
00:52:47,349 --> 00:52:45,760
we all forget this but the episode

1184
00:52:49,109 --> 00:52:47,359
brought this out how she really paid a

1185
00:52:50,710 --> 00:52:49,119
price politically for

1186
00:52:52,710 --> 00:52:50,720
wanting to take a stand on the phoenix

1187
00:52:53,589 --> 00:52:52,720
lights and just doing a simple thing

1188
00:52:55,190 --> 00:52:53,599
like

1189
00:52:56,470 --> 00:52:55,200
following what her constituents said is

1190
00:52:58,390 --> 00:52:56,480
like what is that thing and she just

1191
00:53:00,790 --> 00:52:58,400
started asking questions there was one

1192
00:53:02,549 --> 00:53:00,800
scene in there where uh they this is all

1193
00:53:04,710 --> 00:53:02,559
1997 video

1194
00:53:05,990 --> 00:53:04,720
you see francis barwood at the phoenix

1195
00:53:07,750 --> 00:53:06,000
city council

1196
00:53:08,870 --> 00:53:07,760
asking about

1197
00:53:11,510 --> 00:53:08,880
this

1198
00:53:12,950 --> 00:53:11,520
ufo and like should we look into it and

1199
00:53:16,069 --> 00:53:12,960
all you get is

1200
00:53:19,430 --> 00:53:16,079
stony silence stoney silence

1201
00:53:21,910 --> 00:53:19,440
i've never seen that clip before i i've

1202
00:53:25,190 --> 00:53:21,920
seen the big clip with her you know up

1203
00:53:27,670 --> 00:53:25,200
on the bench and and and her face but

1204
00:53:30,870 --> 00:53:27,680
i've never seen that clip that clip was

1205
00:53:32,950 --> 00:53:30,880
of a private city council meeting

1206
00:53:34,309 --> 00:53:32,960
uh the first time

1207
00:53:36,390 --> 00:53:34,319
you could tell it was the first time

1208
00:53:39,349 --> 00:53:36,400
that she ever brought it up

1209
00:53:40,870 --> 00:53:39,359
and to look at the

1210
00:53:50,309 --> 00:53:40,880
the

1211
00:53:51,750 --> 00:53:50,319
look at her like

1212
00:53:55,349 --> 00:53:51,760
what are you doing

1213
00:53:56,349 --> 00:53:55,359
yeah right what what what what on earth

1214
00:53:58,790 --> 00:53:56,359
it was

1215
00:54:01,270 --> 00:53:58,800
insanely great and i've never seen that

1216
00:54:03,670 --> 00:54:01,280
before and that's an amazing moment 25

1217
00:54:05,109 --> 00:54:03,680
years ago yes yeah right about that and

1218
00:54:07,109 --> 00:54:05,119
um

1219
00:54:10,549 --> 00:54:07,119
you've got this major event over the

1220
00:54:11,910 --> 00:54:10,559
city like everyone's buzzing about it

1221
00:54:13,910 --> 00:54:11,920
and

1222
00:54:16,549 --> 00:54:13,920
no one in the city government

1223
00:54:18,470 --> 00:54:16,559
was willing to even to talk about it

1224
00:54:19,829 --> 00:54:18,480
that's just a shocking moment of culture

1225
00:54:21,109 --> 00:54:19,839
when you really think i mean i don't

1226
00:54:22,549 --> 00:54:21,119
think that would happen today we've

1227
00:54:24,309 --> 00:54:22,559
things have changed a bit you know in

1228
00:54:27,109 --> 00:54:24,319
the culture so that at least there would

1229
00:54:28,790 --> 00:54:27,119
be some discussion but she just got a

1230
00:54:30,150 --> 00:54:28,800
stone wall there and there was a lot of

1231
00:54:31,589 --> 00:54:30,160
other behind the scenes stuff there was

1232
00:54:33,589 --> 00:54:31,599
a claim i don't think it's been

1233
00:54:35,349 --> 00:54:33,599
confirmed but an interesting and

1234
00:54:37,349 --> 00:54:35,359
possibly credible claim

1235
00:54:39,109 --> 00:54:37,359
that jet fighters attempted to intercept

1236
00:54:43,109 --> 00:54:39,119
that object that was over phoenix that

1237
00:54:45,270 --> 00:54:43,119
was new that was true and and so um

1238
00:54:47,430 --> 00:54:45,280
let's let's let's do that for a second

1239
00:54:48,309 --> 00:54:47,440
let's focus on that because i was

1240
00:54:50,630 --> 00:54:48,319
uh

1241
00:54:51,670 --> 00:54:50,640
really surprised and taken aback quite

1242
00:54:52,470 --> 00:54:51,680
frankly

1243
00:54:53,430 --> 00:54:52,480
when

1244
00:54:57,430 --> 00:54:53,440
uh

1245
00:54:58,630 --> 00:54:57,440
that

1246
00:55:08,549 --> 00:54:58,640
the

1247
00:55:11,750 --> 00:55:08,559
as doing this flare exercise

1248
00:55:14,390 --> 00:55:11,760
at 10 p.m the sighting was at 8 30. so

1249
00:55:15,910 --> 00:55:14,400
that didn't match up and and i found

1250
00:55:18,710 --> 00:55:15,920
that pretty interesting then right on

1251
00:55:22,789 --> 00:55:18,720
the heels of that is when they bring up

1252
00:55:26,150 --> 00:55:22,799
the scrambling of of fa-18s

1253
00:55:29,190 --> 00:55:26,160
and uh that happened at eight o'clock

1254
00:55:32,150 --> 00:55:29,200
and the sighting was at 8 30.

1255
00:55:35,510 --> 00:55:32,160
uh they're scrambling jets and then they

1256
00:55:36,549 --> 00:55:35,520
have the radio transmissions in this

1257
00:55:39,510 --> 00:55:36,559
series

1258
00:55:41,589 --> 00:55:39,520
where they were talking about the pilots

1259
00:55:45,510 --> 00:55:41,599
reactions about

1260
00:55:47,349 --> 00:55:45,520
what they saw and and how they saw it

1261
00:55:48,549 --> 00:55:47,359
right

1262
00:55:51,589 --> 00:55:48,559
and that they were they were like

1263
00:55:54,069 --> 00:55:51,599
disturbed disturbed and they just almost

1264
00:55:56,309 --> 00:55:54,079
scared described it as

1265
00:55:58,069 --> 00:55:56,319
they said five lights

1266
00:56:01,829 --> 00:55:58,079
and they didn't know if it was five

1267
00:56:03,910 --> 00:56:01,839
separate aircraft or one large aircraft

1268
00:56:06,069 --> 00:56:03,920
right now that that was that was pretty

1269
00:56:07,270 --> 00:56:06,079
incredible i mean well that's all new i

1270
00:56:09,109 --> 00:56:07,280
mean

1271
00:56:10,549 --> 00:56:09,119
as far as i can i'm concerned that it's

1272
00:56:13,430 --> 00:56:10,559
new to me

1273
00:56:14,950 --> 00:56:13,440
um yeah it was quite quite powerful

1274
00:56:17,109 --> 00:56:14,960
very powerful and then of course there

1275
00:56:19,510 --> 00:56:17,119
was a lot of back story on the build up

1276
00:56:21,589 --> 00:56:19,520
to the uh what fife simon can call the

1277
00:56:23,589 --> 00:56:21,599
alien caper that awful awful press

1278
00:56:25,190 --> 00:56:23,599
conference he did where they brought the

1279
00:56:26,150 --> 00:56:25,200
guy you know the person out in the alien

1280
00:56:27,990 --> 00:56:26,160
costume

1281
00:56:30,789 --> 00:56:28,000
uh what was interesting

1282
00:56:32,390 --> 00:56:30,799
and this was also i'm glad that they

1283
00:56:33,910 --> 00:56:32,400
made this clear

1284
00:56:35,349 --> 00:56:33,920
in the build-up to that press conference

1285
00:56:37,270 --> 00:56:35,359
you know several months had gone by from

1286
00:56:40,390 --> 00:56:37,280
the original sighting to the to that

1287
00:56:42,549 --> 00:56:40,400
press conference and symington had said

1288
00:56:43,829 --> 00:56:42,559
previous he'd given a very strong

1289
00:56:46,309 --> 00:56:43,839
indication that he wanted to do a

1290
00:56:48,630 --> 00:56:46,319
genuine investigation of what happened

1291
00:56:50,150 --> 00:56:48,640
uh all indications were that he was

1292
00:56:51,109 --> 00:56:50,160
going to take it seriously he had been a

1293
00:56:52,390 --> 00:56:51,119
witness

1294
00:56:54,390 --> 00:56:52,400
the world didn't know that at the time

1295
00:56:56,710 --> 00:56:54,400
but he had been but here is he's talking

1296
00:56:58,789 --> 00:56:56,720
about yes we're going to look into this

1297
00:57:00,630 --> 00:56:58,799
and um

1298
00:57:02,309 --> 00:57:00,640
and apparently the day before he had

1299
00:57:05,109 --> 00:57:02,319
some kind of private briefing this is

1300
00:57:07,829 --> 00:57:05,119
what came out in the documentary

1301
00:57:09,670 --> 00:57:07,839
and the next day he has this press

1302
00:57:11,430 --> 00:57:09,680
conference this big build up and they

1303
00:57:13,829 --> 00:57:11,440
just like

1304
00:57:16,710 --> 00:57:13,839
bring this ridiculous sophomoric

1305
00:57:18,630 --> 00:57:16,720
juvenile costume you know of an alien

1306
00:57:20,870 --> 00:57:18,640
and you get francis barwood's reaction

1307
00:57:23,109 --> 00:57:20,880
many years later and i thought that was

1308
00:57:25,109 --> 00:57:23,119
powerful as well she just said i can't

1309
00:57:28,390 --> 00:57:25,119
remember her exact words but

1310
00:57:30,870 --> 00:57:28,400
uh she clearly was very disappointed

1311
00:57:33,829 --> 00:57:30,880
you know by what lincoln did there was a

1312
00:57:36,630 --> 00:57:33,839
there's a a couple of points that again

1313
00:57:38,710 --> 00:57:36,640
i i in all of the shows i've done on

1314
00:57:42,549 --> 00:57:38,720
this maybe this was mentioned i don't

1315
00:57:44,309 --> 00:57:42,559
remember it um and that was that

1316
00:57:46,870 --> 00:57:44,319
fife symington

1317
00:57:47,829 --> 00:57:46,880
had this investigation and these charges

1318
00:57:49,430 --> 00:57:47,839
um

1319
00:57:52,789 --> 00:57:49,440
dropped on him

1320
00:57:56,150 --> 00:57:52,799
corruption embezzlement finances

1321
00:57:57,270 --> 00:57:56,160
and that they were willing to drop those

1322
00:58:00,390 --> 00:57:57,280
charges

1323
00:58:02,870 --> 00:58:00,400
if he changed his tune on on the phoenix

1324
00:58:05,109 --> 00:58:02,880
lights in this uh investigation that he

1325
00:58:06,630 --> 00:58:05,119
wanted to do i've never heard that and

1326
00:58:08,549 --> 00:58:06,640
the other thing

1327
00:58:11,589 --> 00:58:08,559
about

1328
00:58:13,829 --> 00:58:11,599
that he went to prison for two years um

1329
00:58:15,910 --> 00:58:13,839
did he though i don't think he did he

1330
00:58:17,510 --> 00:58:15,920
actually or was it commuted i i wasn't

1331
00:58:19,829 --> 00:58:17,520
quite clear i wasn't clear on that

1332
00:58:22,150 --> 00:58:19,839
either but it said he was convicted uh

1333
00:58:24,309 --> 00:58:22,160
for two years

1334
00:58:25,750 --> 00:58:24,319
and then president clinton pardoned him

1335
00:58:27,349 --> 00:58:25,760
pardoned him

1336
00:58:28,470 --> 00:58:27,359
um well i guess it could have been two

1337
00:58:31,270 --> 00:58:28,480
years clinton would have been president

1338
00:58:32,870 --> 00:58:31,280
in 1999 i i actually don't know

1339
00:58:34,230 --> 00:58:32,880
and i don't want to

1340
00:58:36,150 --> 00:58:34,240
see how can you

1341
00:58:38,630 --> 00:58:36,160
put this up during break uh somebody

1342
00:58:40,710 --> 00:58:38,640
will um uh i'm gonna turn this over to

1343
00:58:42,630 --> 00:58:40,720
the fate or not somebody at wikipedia i

1344
00:58:45,829 --> 00:58:42,640
didn't get a chance to go and

1345
00:58:47,750 --> 00:58:45,839
and and look that up did fife symington

1346
00:58:52,390 --> 00:58:47,760
do any prison time

1347
00:58:55,670 --> 00:58:52,400
uh uh around 1997 and 1999 until

1348
00:58:58,230 --> 00:58:55,680
uh he was pardoned by then president

1349
00:59:00,309 --> 00:58:58,240
clinton somebody popped that up in in

1350
00:59:02,309 --> 00:59:00,319
betty didn't but if he did yeah well i'd

1351
00:59:06,150 --> 00:59:02,319
be surprised but anything's possible

1352
00:59:08,390 --> 00:59:06,160
very very interesting deep dive um now

1353
00:59:12,069 --> 00:59:08,400
as we head to the break

1354
00:59:14,390 --> 00:59:12,079
um uh i want to talk about the the other

1355
00:59:17,829 --> 00:59:14,400
case that uh they did

1356
00:59:19,109 --> 00:59:17,839
in episode one which was c-17 at o'hare

1357
00:59:22,390 --> 00:59:19,119
airport

1358
00:59:24,150 --> 00:59:22,400
uh big case uh it's been covered a lot

1359
00:59:27,109 --> 00:59:24,160
but again

1360
00:59:30,069 --> 00:59:27,119
i learned stuff that i didn't uh know

1361
00:59:33,109 --> 00:59:30,079
before now before we head to the break

1362
00:59:35,030 --> 00:59:33,119
uh francine barwood

1363
00:59:40,950 --> 00:59:35,040
the

1364
00:59:42,710 --> 00:59:40,960
me it's 1997. i was in phoenix when it

1365
00:59:44,950 --> 00:59:42,720
happened i didn't see it

1366
00:59:47,829 --> 00:59:44,960
i found out about it when i got back

1367
00:59:50,309 --> 00:59:47,839
from phoenix on that friday but

1368
00:59:53,270 --> 00:59:50,319
she was young

1369
00:59:55,190 --> 00:59:53,280
and and might i say you know a quite

1370
00:59:57,430 --> 00:59:55,200
good-looking young woman

1371
01:00:00,230 --> 00:59:57,440
and to see her francis barwood yeah

1372
01:00:01,990 --> 01:00:00,240
francis bar and to see her today it

1373
01:00:04,789 --> 01:00:02,000
reminds you

1374
01:00:08,870 --> 01:00:04,799
of how long ago this actually was this

1375
01:00:12,470 --> 01:00:08,880
was you know 25 20 uh 25 years ago

1376
01:00:15,510 --> 01:00:12,480
and she's she's grown up

1377
01:00:17,270 --> 01:00:15,520
and to see the old version of her and

1378
01:00:20,069 --> 01:00:17,280
her speaking today

1379
01:00:21,910 --> 01:00:20,079
it was uh it was it was pretty well done

1380
01:00:23,030 --> 01:00:21,920
and i was i was just taking it back i

1381
01:00:25,349 --> 01:00:23,040
was like wow

1382
01:00:27,829 --> 01:00:25,359
that much time has gone by i guess there

1383
01:00:29,430 --> 01:00:27,839
will be a quarter of a century yes

1384
01:00:31,589 --> 01:00:29,440
yeah and

1385
01:00:33,990 --> 01:00:31,599
and think about what you look like back

1386
01:00:35,829 --> 01:00:34,000
then and and look at you now i had

1387
01:00:38,230 --> 01:00:35,839
beautiful black hair and a gorgeous

1388
01:00:41,270 --> 01:00:38,240
mullet that i preened and loved and

1389
01:00:42,789 --> 01:00:41,280
cared for well maybe not by 97 i think i

1390
01:00:44,069 --> 01:00:42,799
think the mullet had kind of gone away

1391
01:00:46,150 --> 01:00:44,079
by then but

1392
01:00:49,190 --> 01:00:46,160
it was a recent memory and i i still

1393
01:00:52,549 --> 01:00:49,200
missed it in 97. our guest tonight is

1394
01:00:54,789 --> 01:00:52,559
richard dolan we are going to do a full

1395
01:00:57,750 --> 01:00:54,799
review and analysis

1396
01:01:00,710 --> 01:00:57,760
of the new showtime docu-series ufo by

1397
01:01:02,789 --> 01:01:00,720
jj abrams this is fade to black i am

1398
01:01:05,030 --> 01:01:02,799
your host jimmy church oh i've got five

1399
01:01:06,710 --> 01:01:05,040
symington's update we will do that when

1400
01:01:08,470 --> 01:01:06,720
we come back

1401
01:01:10,520 --> 01:01:08,480
i'm your host jimmy church our guest

1402
01:01:22,740 --> 01:01:10,530
tonight richard dolan stay with us

1403
01:01:23,450 --> 01:01:22,750
[Music]

1404
01:01:31,430 --> 01:01:23,460
[Applause]

1405
01:01:33,589 --> 01:01:31,440
[Music]

1406
01:01:36,230 --> 01:01:33,599
this is fade to black with jimmy church

1407
01:01:40,950 --> 01:01:36,240
on the game changer radio network and

1408
01:01:43,430 --> 01:01:40,960
kgra the global radio alliance

1409
01:01:44,470 --> 01:01:43,440
this is kgra digital broadcasting

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01:01:49,910 --> 01:01:44,480
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01:01:55,109 --> 01:01:51,750
this is billy carson with forbidden

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1428
01:02:48,710 --> 01:02:47,039
always wanted

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01:02:51,029 --> 01:02:48,720
damn it

1430
01:02:58,230 --> 01:02:51,039
jimmy church and fade to black on the

1431
01:03:03,829 --> 01:03:01,430
listen i know and you know that you've

1432
01:03:06,069 --> 01:03:03,839
always wanted your first crystal skull

1433
01:03:08,230 --> 01:03:06,079
or maybe you're a collector just like me

1434
01:03:09,990 --> 01:03:08,240
but you just don't know where to go to

1435
01:03:12,069 --> 01:03:10,000
find the real thing

1436
01:03:14,710 --> 01:03:12,079
then i met carolyn ford over at

1437
01:03:17,109 --> 01:03:14,720
einsteinthecrystalskull.com

1438
01:03:19,109 --> 01:03:17,119
carolyn is the guardian of einstein one

1439
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of the most respected ancient crystal

1440
01:03:23,430 --> 01:03:21,599
skulls in the world all of her unique

1441
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skulls have been imprinted sitting with

1442
01:03:27,750 --> 01:03:25,760
einstein in his sacred lodge and are

1443
01:03:30,470 --> 01:03:27,760
carved from the finest gemstone and

1444
01:03:32,470 --> 01:03:30,480
materials imprinting is the process of

1445
01:03:36,069 --> 01:03:32,480
receiving the ancient wisdom from the

1446
01:03:38,470 --> 01:03:36,079
master skull or master computer einstein

1447
01:03:40,230 --> 01:03:38,480
the ancient crystal skull to see

1448
01:03:42,950 --> 01:03:40,240
carolyn's current collection of crystal

1449
01:03:45,349 --> 01:03:42,960
skulls just visit her store at einstein

1450
01:03:47,910 --> 01:03:45,359
the crystalskull.com or click on the

1451
01:03:50,470 --> 01:03:47,920
banner over on our site don't forget to

1452
01:03:53,190 --> 01:03:50,480
use the promo code jimmy at checkout to

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when you take the beans from central

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1468
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1469
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highlights just like the bunker leaning

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01:04:58,230 --> 01:04:54,480
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1475
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1476
01:05:06,789 --> 01:05:02,789
you're listening to my main man jimmy

1477
01:05:10,630 --> 01:05:08,710
hi this is ray sobs here repping the

1478
01:05:13,750 --> 01:05:10,640
planet and you're listening to my good

1479
01:05:16,309 --> 01:05:13,760
friend jimmy church fade to black on the

1480
01:05:19,910 --> 01:05:16,319
game changer network and the kgra

1481
01:05:22,069 --> 01:05:19,920
digital broadcast station

1482
01:05:24,150 --> 01:05:22,079
this is toby kebbel you're listening to

1483
01:05:27,190 --> 01:05:24,160
jimmychurchradio.com

1484
01:05:29,430 --> 01:05:27,200
don't hurt me jimmy i'm only little hey

1485
01:05:34,630 --> 01:05:29,440
i'm adrian grenier and this is ari gold

1486
01:05:38,710 --> 01:05:37,029
hey i'm adrian grenier and i'm ari gold

1487
01:05:40,950 --> 01:05:38,720
we're the honey brothers

1488
01:05:42,470 --> 01:05:40,960
and you're listening to jimmy church a

1489
01:05:44,150 --> 01:05:42,480
revolution

1490
01:05:46,150 --> 01:05:44,160
this is jimmy church of fade to black

1491
01:05:48,470 --> 01:05:46,160
and you can become an official fate or

1492
01:05:52,710 --> 01:05:48,480
not by just going to our membership

1493
01:05:57,109 --> 01:05:54,789
hello this is serena wright taylor from

1494
01:05:59,430 --> 01:05:57,119
conscious life expo and you're listening

1495
01:06:01,829 --> 01:05:59,440
to fade to black with jimmy church who

1496
01:06:07,270 --> 01:06:01,839
holds the lucky pony record for the best

1497
01:06:08,950 --> 01:06:07,280
astrological chart since 1963 true story

1498
01:06:10,630 --> 01:06:08,960
this is micah hanks of the ghrelian

1499
01:06:12,950 --> 01:06:10,640
report and you're listening to jimmy

1500
01:06:14,870 --> 01:06:12,960
church on fade to black across the globe

1501
01:06:18,190 --> 01:06:14,880
on the game changer radio network and

1502
01:06:35,160 --> 01:06:18,200
the one and only kgra radio the planet

1503
01:06:40,150 --> 01:06:38,309
[Music]

1504
01:06:41,750 --> 01:06:40,160
all right welcome back

1505
01:06:44,069 --> 01:06:41,760
faded black i am your host jimmy church

1506
01:06:46,309 --> 01:06:44,079
tonight richard dolan is here we are

1507
01:06:50,789 --> 01:06:46,319
doing a full review and analysis of

1508
01:06:52,870 --> 01:06:50,799
showtime's ufo by j.j abrams now right

1509
01:06:54,870 --> 01:06:52,880
before the break we were talking about

1510
01:06:57,430 --> 01:06:54,880
former arizona governor

1511
01:06:59,430 --> 01:06:57,440
fife symington and if he went to prison

1512
01:07:02,150 --> 01:06:59,440
i found this article richard

1513
01:07:04,309 --> 01:07:02,160
uh by the los angeles times and it says

1514
01:07:07,670 --> 01:07:04,319
here this is the day of his uh

1515
01:07:10,069 --> 01:07:07,680
conviction after uh these charges were

1516
01:07:13,750 --> 01:07:10,079
going down for almost 10 years it says

1517
01:07:16,470 --> 01:07:13,760
usd los angeles times 1998

1518
01:07:19,270 --> 01:07:16,480
u.s district judge roger strand also

1519
01:07:21,589 --> 01:07:19,280
ordered symington to pay a 60 000 fine

1520
01:07:23,990 --> 01:07:21,599
and serve five years probation

1521
01:07:27,190 --> 01:07:24,000
symington was ordered to report to a

1522
01:07:29,109 --> 01:07:27,200
minimum security federal work camp by

1523
01:07:31,270 --> 01:07:29,119
march 20th

1524
01:07:33,910 --> 01:07:31,280
symington immediately resigned as

1525
01:07:35,829 --> 01:07:33,920
governor after his conviction

1526
01:07:38,789 --> 01:07:35,839
multiple accounts providing false

1527
01:07:42,710 --> 01:07:38,799
financial statements holding back tears

1528
01:07:45,430 --> 01:07:42,720
and shaking he hugged his son he said he

1529
01:07:47,990 --> 01:07:45,440
never meant to mislead anyone and he

1530
01:07:49,910 --> 01:07:48,000
should have paid closer attention to his

1531
01:07:52,549 --> 01:07:49,920
financial statements

1532
01:07:55,750 --> 01:07:52,559
and the the federal prosecutor said they

1533
01:07:59,589 --> 01:07:55,760
sent a message to white-collar criminals

1534
01:08:01,190 --> 01:07:59,599
okay there you go so did he do i can't

1535
01:08:03,190 --> 01:08:01,200
did he actually do time or he just did

1536
01:08:05,029 --> 01:08:03,200
like a kind of work release thing it

1537
01:08:08,150 --> 01:08:05,039
looks like he went to a federal work

1538
01:08:09,750 --> 01:08:08,160
camp for about a year this was 1998

1539
01:08:12,390 --> 01:08:09,760
did he have to stay there though do you

1540
01:08:15,109 --> 01:08:12,400
know what i mean uh it says he got uh

1541
01:08:17,510 --> 01:08:15,119
the the headline is former arizona

1542
01:08:18,390 --> 01:08:17,520
governor gets two and a half year prison

1543
01:08:20,870 --> 01:08:18,400
term

1544
01:08:22,709 --> 01:08:20,880
a judge ignored prosecutors request to

1545
01:08:24,390 --> 01:08:22,719
send former governor five simonton to

1546
01:08:26,709 --> 01:08:24,400
prison for a decade

1547
01:08:29,110 --> 01:08:26,719
instead sentencing him monday to two and

1548
01:08:31,110 --> 01:08:29,120
a half years for lying to get millions

1549
01:08:34,550 --> 01:08:31,120
of dollars in loans to shore up his

1550
01:08:36,950 --> 01:08:34,560
failing real estate empire

1551
01:08:38,950 --> 01:08:36,960
okay there you go okay so that's it

1552
01:08:40,550 --> 01:08:38,960
sometimes it looks like he did you know

1553
01:08:42,390 --> 01:08:40,560
maybe six months eight months and then

1554
01:08:44,950 --> 01:08:42,400
he got his pardon

1555
01:08:47,030 --> 01:08:44,960
now uh uh going back to this because i

1556
01:08:49,590 --> 01:08:47,040
want to get to the flavor

1557
01:08:52,630 --> 01:08:49,600
of uh episode one

1558
01:08:54,470 --> 01:08:52,640
but uh when they jumped to the ariz uh

1559
01:08:55,749 --> 01:08:54,480
arizona

1560
01:08:57,590 --> 01:08:55,759
the uh

1561
01:09:00,390 --> 01:08:57,600
uh o'hare

1562
01:09:02,309 --> 01:09:00,400
airport sighting uh above uh united

1563
01:09:04,229 --> 01:09:02,319
terminal c-17

1564
01:09:07,910 --> 01:09:04,239
which lasted for about five minutes

1565
01:09:11,110 --> 01:09:07,920
witnessed by dozens and dozens of people

1566
01:09:13,269 --> 01:09:11,120
workers pilots aircraft mechanics

1567
01:09:15,030 --> 01:09:13,279
um but the one thing that they showed

1568
01:09:16,789 --> 01:09:15,040
there which i had never seen before is

1569
01:09:18,789 --> 01:09:16,799
they had two photographs they had two

1570
01:09:22,630 --> 01:09:18,799
images of this craft

1571
01:09:24,709 --> 01:09:22,640
i had seen the hole in the cloud uh

1572
01:09:26,070 --> 01:09:24,719
shot before but i've never seen shots of

1573
01:09:28,709 --> 01:09:26,080
the craft

1574
01:09:31,590 --> 01:09:28,719
the thing is that there had been those

1575
01:09:33,990 --> 01:09:31,600
those images circulated

1576
01:09:36,070 --> 01:09:34,000
uh in the aftermath of that i recall

1577
01:09:38,789 --> 01:09:36,080
this but there was also a lot of

1578
01:09:40,630 --> 01:09:38,799
argument as you would expect you know

1579
01:09:42,390 --> 01:09:40,640
skeptics would be like that's not a good

1580
01:09:44,789 --> 01:09:42,400
picture that's nothing

1581
01:09:46,550 --> 01:09:44,799
uh so it wasn't really clear that that

1582
01:09:48,870 --> 01:09:46,560
had been resolved but yeah they show you

1583
01:09:50,470 --> 01:09:48,880
so leslie kane's office

1584
01:09:52,070 --> 01:09:50,480
and she's got a nice picture of it

1585
01:09:53,430 --> 01:09:52,080
hanging up there

1586
01:09:55,350 --> 01:09:53,440
by the way i thought

1587
01:09:57,350 --> 01:09:55,360
leslie

1588
01:09:59,189 --> 01:09:57,360
did a very fine job in that episode as

1589
01:10:01,669 --> 01:09:59,199
did let's just give some credit here

1590
01:10:03,189 --> 01:10:01,679
john greenwald was very strong in that

1591
01:10:05,110 --> 01:10:03,199
episode my opinion

1592
01:10:06,070 --> 01:10:05,120
uh he really carried himself off very

1593
01:10:09,030 --> 01:10:06,080
well

1594
01:10:10,790 --> 01:10:09,040
uh diana posalka ditto

1595
01:10:13,110 --> 01:10:10,800
uh who else kevin day was at the very

1596
01:10:14,310 --> 01:10:13,120
end of that who else i think those are

1597
01:10:17,350 --> 01:10:14,320
the main people

1598
01:10:19,510 --> 01:10:17,360
the main three and yeah

1599
01:10:20,630 --> 01:10:19,520
now uh

1600
01:10:26,550 --> 01:10:20,640
the

1601
01:10:29,830 --> 01:10:26,560
for

1602
01:10:31,750 --> 01:10:29,840
the possibility of et's visiting this

1603
01:10:34,310 --> 01:10:31,760
planet um

1604
01:10:36,790 --> 01:10:34,320
do you think that those were

1605
01:10:39,669 --> 01:10:36,800
the two strongest cases to

1606
01:10:41,270 --> 01:10:39,679
present in episode one

1607
01:10:43,110 --> 01:10:41,280
that's a good question i think they're

1608
01:10:44,630 --> 01:10:43,120
both great cases i think the phoenix

1609
01:10:48,149 --> 01:10:44,640
lights case is

1610
01:10:49,750 --> 01:10:48,159
has always been a strong case

1611
01:10:51,590 --> 01:10:49,760
and it's been covered many times you

1612
01:10:52,950 --> 01:10:51,600
know james fox covered it in his first

1613
01:10:54,310 --> 01:10:52,960
documentary out of the blue like a

1614
01:10:55,510 --> 01:10:54,320
million years ago

1615
01:10:57,510 --> 01:10:55,520
and um

1616
01:11:00,470 --> 01:10:57,520
first first documentary i ever appeared

1617
01:11:04,390 --> 01:11:00,480
in it's like a a 60 second clip of a

1618
01:11:05,990 --> 01:11:04,400
very young me without glasses

1619
01:11:07,910 --> 01:11:06,000
uh i had to take them off because they

1620
01:11:09,669 --> 01:11:07,920
reflected light into the camera but

1621
01:11:10,630 --> 01:11:09,679
anyway i think the phoenix lights is a

1622
01:11:15,110 --> 01:11:10,640
good

1623
01:11:17,750 --> 01:11:15,120
actually i think fox covered

1624
01:11:20,950 --> 01:11:17,760
o'hare in the same documentary

1625
01:11:22,470 --> 01:11:20,960
i believe um i i believe so wait well

1626
01:11:25,189 --> 01:11:22,480
the original version of out of the blue

1627
01:11:26,790 --> 01:11:25,199
was was before o'hare maybe in when he

1628
01:11:29,750 --> 01:11:26,800
did a remake

1629
01:11:31,910 --> 01:11:29,760
i can't remember out of the blue

1630
01:11:32,950 --> 01:11:31,920
or i know what i saw

1631
01:11:34,470 --> 01:11:32,960
yeah that's another one that's a

1632
01:11:37,669 --> 01:11:34,480
different one yeah yeah i think uh

1633
01:11:39,030 --> 01:11:37,679
o'hara was in in that one as was uh

1634
01:11:41,189 --> 01:11:39,040
leslie kane

1635
01:11:43,189 --> 01:11:41,199
okay but anyway just to answer your

1636
01:11:45,030 --> 01:11:43,199
question i i think o'hare is always a

1637
01:11:46,709 --> 01:11:45,040
strong case yes i think it's a very fine

1638
01:11:48,870 --> 01:11:46,719
case

1639
01:11:50,470 --> 01:11:48,880
so um i mean you could check you could

1640
01:11:52,709 --> 01:11:50,480
have picked different cases there's the

1641
01:11:54,630 --> 01:11:52,719
washington dc 2002

1642
01:11:56,870 --> 01:11:54,640
over flight that's an amazing case it's

1643
01:11:58,950 --> 01:11:56,880
been kind of forgotten but a very

1644
01:12:01,910 --> 01:11:58,960
important case at the time you have

1645
01:12:03,270 --> 01:12:01,920
uh f-16s not only seen by witnesses on

1646
01:12:06,550 --> 01:12:03,280
the ground but confirmed by the united

1647
01:12:08,070 --> 01:12:06,560
states air force chasing in um

1648
01:12:10,070 --> 01:12:08,080
actually i would say multiple unknown

1649
01:12:12,870 --> 01:12:10,080
objects over dc airspace

1650
01:12:16,390 --> 01:12:12,880
the air force confirmed one unknown but

1651
01:12:18,390 --> 01:12:16,400
uh ice their witnesses saw multiple

1652
01:12:20,630 --> 01:12:18,400
unknowns being chased by f-16 so that

1653
01:12:21,990 --> 01:12:20,640
that's one you could have used

1654
01:12:23,669 --> 01:12:22,000
but you know i think the choice of

1655
01:12:25,750 --> 01:12:23,679
o'hare is good stephenville would be the

1656
01:12:27,590 --> 01:12:25,760
other one of the early the first decade

1657
01:12:31,669 --> 01:12:27,600
of the 21st century stephenville texas

1658
01:12:34,550 --> 01:12:31,679
2008 was a very another major event

1659
01:12:36,790 --> 01:12:34,560
very similar to the phoenix lights

1660
01:12:39,350 --> 01:12:36,800
that one happened during the day but the

1661
01:12:41,189 --> 01:12:39,360
same description of a very large black

1662
01:12:44,790 --> 01:12:41,199
triangle craft

1663
01:12:46,870 --> 01:12:44,800
and uh seen again by multiple witnesses

1664
01:12:48,470 --> 01:12:46,880
it's it's a great case that's right

1665
01:12:50,310 --> 01:12:48,480
unfortunately the main journalists who

1666
01:12:55,590 --> 01:12:50,320
covered that uh passed away recently it

1667
01:12:59,669 --> 01:12:57,350
so she would not have been available for

1668
01:13:00,470 --> 01:12:59,679
that but uh it's a great case

1669
01:13:02,070 --> 01:13:00,480
now

1670
01:13:09,189 --> 01:13:02,080
what did you

1671
01:13:13,270 --> 01:13:09,199
an assessment after watching episode one

1672
01:13:15,350 --> 01:13:13,280
and if you can get into jj abrams head

1673
01:13:17,750 --> 01:13:15,360
what do you think he was trying to say

1674
01:13:19,350 --> 01:13:17,760
in episode one yeah that's a good

1675
01:13:21,110 --> 01:13:19,360
question

1676
01:13:22,630 --> 01:13:21,120
first of all i would just say i think i

1677
01:13:26,709 --> 01:13:22,640
like you i would consider it above

1678
01:13:28,550 --> 01:13:26,719
average ufo treatment you know for

1679
01:13:30,630 --> 01:13:28,560
what we normally see i mean i don't know

1680
01:13:31,990 --> 01:13:30,640
if it's the best i've ever seen i would

1681
01:13:33,669 --> 01:13:32,000
probably wouldn't say that but it was it

1682
01:13:36,310 --> 01:13:33,679
was good

1683
01:13:38,310 --> 01:13:36,320
uh what was he trying to do

1684
01:13:42,390 --> 01:13:38,320
well i mean one thing he definitely did

1685
01:13:44,470 --> 01:13:42,400
was was to demonstrate that a ufos are a

1686
01:13:47,270 --> 01:13:44,480
real thing they're not imaginary you've

1687
01:13:48,229 --> 01:13:47,280
got very real serious people reporting

1688
01:13:50,149 --> 01:13:48,239
them

1689
01:13:52,470 --> 01:13:50,159
uh he made it very clear that there were

1690
01:13:54,149 --> 01:13:52,480
government shenanigans and hiding

1691
01:13:56,149 --> 01:13:54,159
the truth about this

1692
01:13:58,390 --> 01:13:56,159
and covering it up so he hit all those

1693
01:14:00,870 --> 01:13:58,400
points very effectively

1694
01:14:02,229 --> 01:14:00,880
uh you know now in terms of going

1695
01:14:04,229 --> 01:14:02,239
farther

1696
01:14:07,030 --> 01:14:04,239
sounds like maybe you're asking

1697
01:14:08,790 --> 01:14:07,040
was he trying to get at his e.t or some

1698
01:14:10,229 --> 01:14:08,800
kind of secret tech or whatever and i

1699
01:14:11,750 --> 01:14:10,239
don't you know i don't really think he

1700
01:14:13,830 --> 01:14:11,760
explores

1701
01:14:15,270 --> 01:14:13,840
that in that first episode i don't i

1702
01:14:16,630 --> 01:14:15,280
didn't really get a sense that he tried

1703
01:14:17,750 --> 01:14:16,640
to do that at all

1704
01:14:19,990 --> 01:14:17,760
but

1705
01:14:21,590 --> 01:14:20,000
i think he did a very satisfactory very

1706
01:14:24,149 --> 01:14:21,600
decent job

1707
01:14:26,149 --> 01:14:24,159
uh simply of pointing out that

1708
01:14:29,669 --> 01:14:26,159
these are two really strong excellent

1709
01:14:31,750 --> 01:14:29,679
cases covered by responsible people

1710
01:14:33,990 --> 01:14:31,760
um and there was some backstory too

1711
01:14:35,590 --> 01:14:34,000
actually uh particularly when john

1712
01:14:36,870 --> 01:14:35,600
greenwald was being interviewed talking

1713
01:14:39,510 --> 01:14:36,880
about the old

1714
01:14:41,590 --> 01:14:39,520
blue book era you know 1940s and 50s and

1715
01:14:43,430 --> 01:14:41,600
60s

1716
01:14:46,550 --> 01:14:43,440
they even brought out a couple of brief

1717
01:14:49,750 --> 01:14:46,560
clips of air force pilots back in those

1718
01:14:51,669 --> 01:14:49,760
days 1940s and 50s talking briefly about

1719
01:14:52,630 --> 01:14:51,679
encounters that they had

1720
01:14:54,070 --> 01:14:52,640
during

1721
01:14:56,550 --> 01:14:54,080
that early period i thought that was

1722
01:14:57,990 --> 01:14:56,560
good because all too frequently you know

1723
01:14:59,669 --> 01:14:58,000
we're we're finding the history just

1724
01:15:01,830 --> 01:14:59,679
being drained right out of the ufo

1725
01:15:03,350 --> 01:15:01,840
subject

1726
01:15:05,430 --> 01:15:03,360
ever since the nimitz encounter really

1727
01:15:07,669 --> 01:15:05,440
became a thing ever since ttsa started

1728
01:15:09,270 --> 01:15:07,679
promoting it

1729
01:15:11,830 --> 01:15:09,280
you've seen everyone just in the

1730
01:15:13,910 --> 01:15:11,840
mainstream pretend as if ufos first

1731
01:15:15,510 --> 01:15:13,920
appeared in 2004

1732
01:15:18,550 --> 01:15:15,520
and that's a real mistake because that

1733
01:15:20,390 --> 01:15:18,560
that gives you a very skewed idea of the

1734
01:15:22,070 --> 01:15:20,400
phenomenon particularly when you start

1735
01:15:23,350 --> 01:15:22,080
getting people talking about well this

1736
01:15:25,830 --> 01:15:23,360
is just black budget tech that they're

1737
01:15:27,750 --> 01:15:25,840
hiding and that just becomes a much

1738
01:15:29,590 --> 01:15:27,760
weaker argument when you start looking

1739
01:15:31,270 --> 01:15:29,600
at the long history of this

1740
01:15:33,189 --> 01:15:31,280
where you find out you know there are

1741
01:15:35,270 --> 01:15:33,199
objects of identical performances the

1742
01:15:37,430 --> 01:15:35,280
tic tac or

1743
01:15:39,270 --> 01:15:37,440
what happened at o'hare and o6 you know

1744
01:15:40,390 --> 01:15:39,280
these were being reported in the 1940s

1745
01:15:42,550 --> 01:15:40,400
and 50s

1746
01:15:44,790 --> 01:15:42,560
there makes it harder to make that case

1747
01:15:47,590 --> 01:15:44,800
there was um i

1748
01:15:50,310 --> 01:15:47,600
this was something else without

1749
01:15:53,910 --> 01:15:50,320
uh having seen at this point episodes

1750
01:15:55,430 --> 01:15:53,920
two three and four i was

1751
01:15:58,070 --> 01:15:55,440
thinking

1752
01:16:01,110 --> 01:15:58,080
that abrams and i didn't know any of

1753
01:16:04,229 --> 01:16:01,120
this right but i was thinking about uh

1754
01:16:06,149 --> 01:16:04,239
omua i was thinking about avi loeb i was

1755
01:16:09,189 --> 01:16:06,159
thinking about some of the science i was

1756
01:16:10,229 --> 01:16:09,199
thinking about the hubble telescope and

1757
01:16:16,149 --> 01:16:10,239
and

1758
01:16:17,750 --> 01:16:16,159
that there was an opportunity for jj to

1759
01:16:20,630 --> 01:16:17,760
continue

1760
01:16:23,830 --> 01:16:20,640
um on the back of episode one where

1761
01:16:26,310 --> 01:16:23,840
you've got multiple witnesses and and

1762
01:16:28,870 --> 01:16:26,320
and evidence and photographs and video

1763
01:16:31,189 --> 01:16:28,880
and and all of that that supported

1764
01:16:37,430 --> 01:16:31,199
uh not only o'hare but the phoenix

1765
01:16:38,630 --> 01:16:37,440
lights and that this et ufo question

1766
01:16:41,189 --> 01:16:38,640
would be

1767
01:16:43,030 --> 01:16:41,199
then looked into uh as far as the

1768
01:16:45,830 --> 01:16:43,040
science side goes

1769
01:16:47,669 --> 01:16:45,840
um i there's a spoiler alert here none

1770
01:16:48,790 --> 01:16:47,679
of that happened in episodes two three

1771
01:16:50,790 --> 01:16:48,800
and four

1772
01:16:53,270 --> 01:16:50,800
but i thought i'm kind of glad that

1773
01:16:54,870 --> 01:16:53,280
didn't happen i'll honestly say and i

1774
01:16:56,870 --> 01:16:54,880
think you know the astronomers look i

1775
01:16:59,270 --> 01:16:56,880
mean i think it's great that avi loeb

1776
01:17:01,830 --> 01:16:59,280
has put himself out there to support

1777
01:17:03,350 --> 01:17:01,840
at least you know the legitimacy of

1778
01:17:05,830 --> 01:17:03,360
trying to study the possibility that

1779
01:17:08,709 --> 01:17:05,840
there's some life here like ufos but the

1780
01:17:10,229 --> 01:17:08,719
fact is look astronomers have the worst

1781
01:17:11,830 --> 01:17:10,239
track record

1782
01:17:13,910 --> 01:17:11,840
in being able to talk intelligently

1783
01:17:15,350 --> 01:17:13,920
about ufos i mean for the most part all

1784
01:17:17,830 --> 01:17:15,360
right there was jl and heineken in the

1785
01:17:19,990 --> 01:17:17,840
olden days okay with him accepted i mean

1786
01:17:22,390 --> 01:17:20,000
most astronomers right up to deal

1787
01:17:24,229 --> 01:17:22,400
degrasse tyson carl sagan none of these

1788
01:17:26,470 --> 01:17:24,239
people really spoke intelligently

1789
01:17:28,149 --> 01:17:26,480
publicly about ufos whatever they say

1790
01:17:29,910 --> 01:17:28,159
privately is another matter so they

1791
01:17:31,910 --> 01:17:29,920
don't really have anything to contribute

1792
01:17:33,590 --> 01:17:31,920
to our knowledge on this they could if

1793
01:17:35,830 --> 01:17:33,600
they if they did some homework and maybe

1794
01:17:38,149 --> 01:17:35,840
did you know a little bit of work on it

1795
01:17:39,110 --> 01:17:38,159
i think it would be more valuable

1796
01:17:40,229 --> 01:17:39,120
uh

1797
01:17:43,030 --> 01:17:40,239
if you want to go into the theme of

1798
01:17:45,189 --> 01:17:43,040
space to start looking at space-based uh

1799
01:17:47,430 --> 01:17:45,199
anomalies because there's a lot of that

1800
01:17:48,790 --> 01:17:47,440
and i don't hear any astronomers

1801
01:17:51,270 --> 01:17:48,800
talking about that

1802
01:17:52,870 --> 01:17:51,280
so that would be if i were to continue

1803
01:17:54,709 --> 01:17:52,880
on with the space theme that's where i

1804
01:17:57,030 --> 01:17:54,719
would want to go not not the astronomers

1805
01:17:58,630 --> 01:17:57,040
they have not offered anything avilobe

1806
01:18:01,030 --> 01:17:58,640
is an exception

1807
01:18:03,270 --> 01:18:01,040
to to some extent i mean

1808
01:18:05,590 --> 01:18:03,280
yes he's been positive but who else

1809
01:18:07,430 --> 01:18:05,600
really there's just been no

1810
01:18:11,350 --> 01:18:07,440
there's been no intelligent conversation

1811
01:18:13,750 --> 01:18:11,360
coming from astronomers on ufos in ages

1812
01:18:15,910 --> 01:18:13,760
and it isn't hynic really right right

1813
01:18:17,270 --> 01:18:15,920
right and uh

1814
01:18:20,709 --> 01:18:17,280
my

1815
01:18:24,310 --> 01:18:20,719
if i have a take i felt and i

1816
01:18:26,470 --> 01:18:24,320
and you know again uh in uh

1817
01:18:29,030 --> 01:18:26,480
to be honest and transparent about this

1818
01:18:30,709 --> 01:18:29,040
i immediately called richardson man

1819
01:18:32,470 --> 01:18:30,719
you got to check this out not only do

1820
01:18:35,910 --> 01:18:32,480
you have to check this out

1821
01:18:37,669 --> 01:18:35,920
but i think that there is a strong this

1822
01:18:38,790 --> 01:18:37,679
is before we got to episodes two three

1823
01:18:41,910 --> 01:18:38,800
and four

1824
01:18:43,110 --> 01:18:41,920
that this is this is an episode in my

1825
01:18:45,030 --> 01:18:43,120
opinion

1826
01:18:48,310 --> 01:18:45,040
about et

1827
01:18:50,470 --> 01:18:48,320
ufos and the phenomena and i think it's

1828
01:18:52,390 --> 01:18:50,480
one of the best things that i have seen

1829
01:18:54,470 --> 01:18:52,400
yet and those were my words to you

1830
01:18:56,310 --> 01:18:54,480
richard

1831
01:19:00,149 --> 01:18:56,320
right and

1832
01:19:01,669 --> 01:19:00,159
after um after your

1833
01:19:03,750 --> 01:19:01,679
viewing of it

1834
01:19:05,990 --> 01:19:03,760
do you do you agree with that or do you

1835
01:19:07,990 --> 01:19:06,000
think that i was a little bit too strong

1836
01:19:09,750 --> 01:19:08,000
no i i think you were pretty much

1837
01:19:11,510 --> 01:19:09,760
justified i i don't know if it if i

1838
01:19:13,830 --> 01:19:11,520
would say it's the best

1839
01:19:16,390 --> 01:19:13,840
there's been some very good treatments

1840
01:19:18,149 --> 01:19:16,400
of ufo and documentary form

1841
01:19:19,830 --> 01:19:18,159
by a lot of folks over the last few

1842
01:19:22,470 --> 01:19:19,840
years and so

1843
01:19:24,149 --> 01:19:22,480
yeah jj abrams is highly professional

1844
01:19:26,310 --> 01:19:24,159
production values are great but in terms

1845
01:19:27,830 --> 01:19:26,320
of content i don't know i would say it

1846
01:19:30,950 --> 01:19:27,840
was very good

1847
01:19:32,630 --> 01:19:30,960
i i wouldn't i don't know if i would say

1848
01:19:34,950 --> 01:19:32,640
it's the best that i've ever seen but it

1849
01:19:37,350 --> 01:19:34,960
was certainly worthwhile yeah i'm glad

1850
01:19:39,830 --> 01:19:37,360
i'm glad he handled he handled the

1851
01:19:40,790 --> 01:19:39,840
subject matter in that first episode

1852
01:19:43,350 --> 01:19:40,800
uh

1853
01:19:46,470 --> 01:19:43,360
nicely it was fine okay

1854
01:19:48,630 --> 01:19:46,480
let's move on we're gonna uh

1855
01:19:51,110 --> 01:19:48,640
i i want to

1856
01:19:53,430 --> 01:19:51,120
because we've got so much to cover

1857
01:19:56,709 --> 01:19:53,440
um and i want everybody to go and watch

1858
01:20:00,390 --> 01:19:56,719
this so you're gonna watch episode one

1859
01:20:04,149 --> 01:20:00,400
and episode two is equally good

1860
01:20:04,950 --> 01:20:04,159
but i wanna skip forward to episode

1861
01:20:07,590 --> 01:20:04,960
three

1862
01:20:10,390 --> 01:20:07,600
and i want to do that for a few reasons

1863
01:20:15,790 --> 01:20:13,270
in your opinion

1864
01:20:20,550 --> 01:20:15,800
was episode three

1865
01:20:23,350 --> 01:20:20,560
continuing what episode one started

1866
01:20:25,669 --> 01:20:23,360
or was there something different

1867
01:20:27,590 --> 01:20:25,679
okay so now we're getting so i had a

1868
01:20:29,189 --> 01:20:27,600
real problem with episode three i'm just

1869
01:20:32,149 --> 01:20:29,199
gonna put that right out there and we're

1870
01:20:35,350 --> 01:20:32,159
gonna hopefully discuss why

1871
01:20:37,030 --> 01:20:35,360
so when i when i watched episode three

1872
01:20:39,030 --> 01:20:37,040
you know what it reminded me of actually

1873
01:20:41,590 --> 01:20:39,040
i'm just thinking of this now back in uh

1874
01:20:43,990 --> 01:20:41,600
i think like 2004

1875
01:20:45,189 --> 01:20:44,000
there was a ufo special hosted by peter

1876
01:20:47,270 --> 01:20:45,199
jennings

1877
01:20:49,270 --> 01:20:47,280
i can't remember the name of it

1878
01:20:51,030 --> 01:20:49,280
but it was a big there was a big build

1879
01:20:53,350 --> 01:20:51,040
up and i remember a lot of folks in the

1880
01:20:54,070 --> 01:20:53,360
ufo community like very excited about

1881
01:20:55,750 --> 01:20:54,080
this

1882
01:20:57,750 --> 01:20:55,760
and what ended up happening it was like

1883
01:20:59,669 --> 01:20:57,760
i likened it to a balloon

1884
01:21:01,430 --> 01:20:59,679
you inflate the balloon for the first

1885
01:21:03,430 --> 01:21:01,440
half of the episode and then you deflate

1886
01:21:05,110 --> 01:21:03,440
the balloon in the second half that's

1887
01:21:06,629 --> 01:21:05,120
what that's what the

1888
01:21:08,470 --> 01:21:06,639
the peter jennings special did and

1889
01:21:11,510 --> 01:21:08,480
that's i think exactly what episode

1890
01:21:13,669 --> 01:21:11,520
three did to me for me in this series

1891
01:21:16,070 --> 01:21:13,679
so it was a real deflation of the

1892
01:21:18,790 --> 01:21:16,080
balloon and and the theme

1893
01:21:21,910 --> 01:21:18,800
that was hit in episode three

1894
01:21:23,750 --> 01:21:21,920
was i guess twofold one was

1895
01:21:26,390 --> 01:21:23,760
that this look

1896
01:21:28,390 --> 01:21:26,400
probably like us secret tech

1897
01:21:30,470 --> 01:21:28,400
and two that like the whole ufo

1898
01:21:32,390 --> 01:21:30,480
phenomenon was basically

1899
01:21:35,189 --> 01:21:32,400
created by the united states as a as a

1900
01:21:36,950 --> 01:21:35,199
tool in the cold war against the soviets

1901
01:21:39,350 --> 01:21:36,960
now this was put out really specifically

1902
01:21:41,270 --> 01:21:39,360
by one specific uh person at the

1903
01:21:43,350 --> 01:21:41,280
interview that's james carrion former

1904
01:21:45,350 --> 01:21:43,360
international director of mufon

1905
01:21:47,270 --> 01:21:45,360
but it was a very like that the theme

1906
01:21:50,310 --> 01:21:47,280
was brought out very

1907
01:21:52,950 --> 01:21:50,320
significantly uh and and so you're left

1908
01:21:54,550 --> 01:21:52,960
with this feeling in that episode

1909
01:21:56,709 --> 01:21:54,560
that the government's trying to make you

1910
01:21:59,669 --> 01:21:56,719
believe in ufos

1911
01:22:01,030 --> 01:21:59,679
as a way to hide their secret technology

1912
01:22:03,990 --> 01:22:01,040
and and i just have to say right here

1913
01:22:06,790 --> 01:22:04,000
before you jump in that's complete bs

1914
01:22:08,310 --> 01:22:06,800
that's complete utter nonsense

1915
01:22:09,910 --> 01:22:08,320
so when you

1916
01:22:12,470 --> 01:22:09,920
you could only make that argument if you

1917
01:22:14,629 --> 01:22:12,480
do the the most careful cherry-picking

1918
01:22:16,629 --> 01:22:14,639
of the history that we have first of all

1919
01:22:18,550 --> 01:22:16,639
for almost all of the history of the ufo

1920
01:22:21,510 --> 01:22:18,560
phenomenon the united states government

1921
01:22:23,669 --> 01:22:21,520
vociferously denied the existence of

1922
01:22:25,750 --> 01:22:23,679
ufos of the public right and not only

1923
01:22:28,390 --> 01:22:25,760
did they deny it they actively attempted

1924
01:22:30,709 --> 01:22:28,400
to debunk it through the 40s through the

1925
01:22:33,830 --> 01:22:30,719
50s through the 60s like this was the

1926
01:22:35,750 --> 01:22:33,840
thing they weren't ever promoting this

1927
01:22:38,870 --> 01:22:35,760
and even something like roswell where

1928
01:22:40,550 --> 01:22:38,880
that was brought up as complete disinfo

1929
01:22:42,470 --> 01:22:40,560
to be used against the soviets i mean to

1930
01:22:45,350 --> 01:22:42,480
me that's an absurd argument

1931
01:22:47,990 --> 01:22:45,360
that's an absurd argument roswell

1932
01:22:49,350 --> 01:22:48,000
roswell died the day it came out as a

1933
01:22:51,350 --> 01:22:49,360
news story and was buried for the next

1934
01:22:53,350 --> 01:22:51,360
30 years no one talked about roswell in

1935
01:22:54,229 --> 01:22:53,360
the 1940s and 50s

1936
01:22:56,550 --> 01:22:54,239
um

1937
01:22:58,470 --> 01:22:56,560
and we to believe that this whole thing

1938
01:22:59,510 --> 01:22:58,480
was a one-day

1939
01:23:01,270 --> 01:22:59,520
uh

1940
01:23:04,149 --> 01:23:01,280
flash in the pan for a couple of

1941
01:23:05,590 --> 01:23:04,159
newspapers in the western united states

1942
01:23:08,390 --> 01:23:05,600
all right

1943
01:23:10,070 --> 01:23:08,400
that we're going to fake out the soviets

1944
01:23:11,910 --> 01:23:10,080
with that like

1945
01:23:13,430 --> 01:23:11,920
no i don't buy it for instance and

1946
01:23:15,030 --> 01:23:13,440
there's nothing to hang your hat on in

1947
01:23:18,149 --> 01:23:15,040
terms of evidence for that

1948
01:23:19,830 --> 01:23:18,159
not at all and and not only that

1949
01:23:20,950 --> 01:23:19,840
when you start talking about roswell

1950
01:23:22,629 --> 01:23:20,960
witnesses

1951
01:23:24,070 --> 01:23:22,639
i mean some of the most important ones

1952
01:23:27,510 --> 01:23:24,080
were just totally ignored i mean jesse

1953
01:23:29,590 --> 01:23:27,520
marcel senior was ignored um but even

1954
01:23:31,990 --> 01:23:29,600
someone like general thomas dubose who

1955
01:23:33,590 --> 01:23:32,000
was who was assistant to general roger

1956
01:23:35,590 --> 01:23:33,600
raymie at the press conference where you

1957
01:23:37,430 --> 01:23:35,600
know bart poor jesse marcel is looking

1958
01:23:38,870 --> 01:23:37,440
at the the

1959
01:23:40,470 --> 01:23:38,880
balloon target that they're taking

1960
01:23:43,350 --> 01:23:40,480
pictures which by the way marcel said

1961
01:23:45,110 --> 01:23:43,360
they switched out for the picture

1962
01:23:47,189 --> 01:23:45,120
but thomas dubose years later is

1963
01:23:49,350 --> 01:23:47,199
interviewed by stan friedman i think

1964
01:23:52,790 --> 01:23:49,360
possibly kevin randall

1965
01:23:54,709 --> 01:23:52,800
dubose talked very very openly about how

1966
01:23:57,910 --> 01:23:54,719
that whole thing

1967
01:24:00,070 --> 01:23:57,920
was ultra ultra top secret and

1968
01:24:01,990 --> 01:24:00,080
he wasn't indicating at all that this

1969
01:24:04,390 --> 01:24:02,000
was some disinfo against the soviet

1970
01:24:07,590 --> 01:24:04,400
union not even remotely

1971
01:24:09,669 --> 01:24:07,600
i mean this is just a weak argument

1972
01:24:11,270 --> 01:24:09,679
it's not that the u.s doesn't try to

1973
01:24:13,510 --> 01:24:11,280
hide some of its tech you know they

1974
01:24:15,270 --> 01:24:13,520
brought out richard doughty for this

1975
01:24:17,110 --> 01:24:15,280
dodie was very

1976
01:24:18,470 --> 01:24:17,120
you know pretty upfront i thought in

1977
01:24:19,910 --> 01:24:18,480
that segment he's like yeah you know

1978
01:24:21,430 --> 01:24:19,920
paul bennowitz is looking at things he

1979
01:24:22,870 --> 01:24:21,440
wasn't supposed to be looking at and

1980
01:24:25,430 --> 01:24:22,880
sure i was directed to tell him it was

1981
01:24:27,910 --> 01:24:25,440
ufos or at least let him think it was

1982
01:24:28,950 --> 01:24:27,920
since he was predisposed to believing

1983
01:24:35,189 --> 01:24:28,960
that

1984
01:24:38,149 --> 01:24:35,199
formal us policy

1985
01:24:40,709 --> 01:24:38,159
to promote a belief in ufos

1986
01:24:42,149 --> 01:24:40,719
year in year out no way

1987
01:24:43,669 --> 01:24:42,159
not a chance

1988
01:24:47,510 --> 01:24:43,679
it was uh

1989
01:24:49,590 --> 01:24:47,520
the ufo phenomenon seeing is believing

1990
01:24:50,629 --> 01:24:49,600
by peter jennings

1991
01:24:53,350 --> 01:24:50,639
yes

1992
01:24:55,110 --> 01:24:53,360
on abc now um

1993
01:24:56,950 --> 01:24:55,120
we can't

1994
01:24:58,870 --> 01:24:56,960
uh continue

1995
01:25:01,990 --> 01:24:58,880
without talking about

1996
01:25:04,790 --> 01:25:02,000
james carrion and and who he is and how

1997
01:25:06,070 --> 01:25:04,800
he plays into this

1998
01:25:10,229 --> 01:25:06,080
uh

1999
01:25:12,390 --> 01:25:10,239
narrative that jj abrams is presenting

2000
01:25:13,750 --> 01:25:12,400
most people you gotta remember james

2001
01:25:14,709 --> 01:25:13,760
carrion

2002
01:25:16,790 --> 01:25:14,719
uh

2003
01:25:20,310 --> 01:25:16,800
goes back to

2004
01:25:22,950 --> 01:25:20,320
uh 2006 when he was the international

2005
01:25:24,790 --> 01:25:22,960
director of mufon

2006
01:25:27,590 --> 01:25:24,800
through 2009

2007
01:25:29,990 --> 01:25:27,600
so he was on board for three years

2008
01:25:31,590 --> 01:25:30,000
but um

2009
01:25:34,550 --> 01:25:31,600
there's that i'm going to have you

2010
01:25:37,590 --> 01:25:34,560
comment about who james carrion is but

2011
01:25:39,590 --> 01:25:37,600
virtually forgotten in the ufo world

2012
01:25:43,350 --> 01:25:39,600
most people don't unless you

2013
01:25:45,990 --> 01:25:43,360
uh go back that far or our study

2014
01:25:47,750 --> 01:25:46,000
of ufo history and mufon specifically

2015
01:25:50,390 --> 01:25:47,760
you may have never heard of james

2016
01:25:53,669 --> 01:25:50,400
carrion before but here he is

2017
01:25:57,110 --> 01:25:53,679
prominently featured in episode three

2018
01:25:58,149 --> 01:25:57,120
and it was james that negotiated the

2019
01:26:01,430 --> 01:25:58,159
deal

2020
01:26:03,030 --> 01:26:01,440
with bigelow aerospace uh which at the

2021
01:26:05,669 --> 01:26:03,040
same time

2022
01:26:06,629 --> 01:26:05,679
uh nids was going on

2023
01:26:09,189 --> 01:26:06,639
so

2024
01:26:11,910 --> 01:26:09,199
um well i think ned's this was done by

2025
01:26:14,950 --> 01:26:11,920
then what weren't they but but it was

2026
01:26:19,189 --> 01:26:14,960
that's not what i'm suggesting here mids

2027
01:26:20,390 --> 01:26:19,199
was part of this circle of people is

2028
01:26:22,470 --> 01:26:20,400
what i want to say

2029
01:26:26,629 --> 01:26:22,480
so um uh

2030
01:26:29,750 --> 01:26:26,639
so let's back up why was james carrion

2031
01:26:31,510 --> 01:26:29,760
brought out of the ashes right he's like

2032
01:26:33,990 --> 01:26:31,520
the phoenix right now

2033
01:26:36,709 --> 01:26:34,000
well i mean certainly i do not know that

2034
01:26:39,990 --> 01:26:36,719
i met james a number of times in fact uh

2035
01:26:42,629 --> 01:26:40,000
back in 07 uh james invited myself

2036
01:26:44,950 --> 01:26:42,639
stanton friedman dr bruce mcabee number

2037
01:26:47,430 --> 01:26:44,960
of other researchers

2038
01:26:49,189 --> 01:26:47,440
uh out to uh where were we either to

2039
01:26:51,189 --> 01:26:49,199
denver or boulder where wherever we were

2040
01:26:53,590 --> 01:26:51,199
out to where he was

2041
01:26:54,870 --> 01:26:53,600
for an extended study like a ufo study

2042
01:26:56,310 --> 01:26:54,880
it was actually quite interesting we all

2043
01:26:57,910 --> 01:26:56,320
had a good time

2044
01:27:00,149 --> 01:26:57,920
i have nothing against james personally

2045
01:27:02,550 --> 01:27:00,159
i've had you know fine interactions with

2046
01:27:04,550 --> 01:27:02,560
him but uh

2047
01:27:06,310 --> 01:27:04,560
when he started talking about

2048
01:27:07,830 --> 01:27:06,320
really the awful nature of ufo

2049
01:27:09,830 --> 01:27:07,840
researchers i mean he just spoke with

2050
01:27:10,950 --> 01:27:09,840
total contempt about ufo research i was

2051
01:27:12,550 --> 01:27:10,960
thinking wow

2052
01:27:13,830 --> 01:27:12,560
what do you think of me what did you

2053
01:27:15,910 --> 01:27:13,840
actually think of me all this time or

2054
01:27:16,709 --> 01:27:15,920
stanton or bruce or a number of other

2055
01:27:18,390 --> 01:27:16,719
folks

2056
01:27:20,709 --> 01:27:18,400
but having said all of that yeah i mean

2057
01:27:25,110 --> 01:27:23,430
james i i don't remember what his job

2058
01:27:26,470 --> 01:27:25,120
was before he had an intelligence

2059
01:27:29,030 --> 01:27:26,480
community background i can't remember if

2060
01:27:30,870 --> 01:27:29,040
it was navy or nsa it was one of those

2061
01:27:32,550 --> 01:27:30,880
someone can look that up too

2062
01:27:34,709 --> 01:27:32,560
um and that doesn't look i'm not trying

2063
01:27:36,070 --> 01:27:34,719
to smear him and impugn him and say oh

2064
01:27:37,510 --> 01:27:36,080
well he's an intelligence guy coming

2065
01:27:39,669 --> 01:27:37,520
into the ufos but he was he was an

2066
01:27:40,470 --> 01:27:39,679
intelligence guy coming into the field

2067
01:27:41,830 --> 01:27:40,480
and

2068
01:27:42,790 --> 01:27:41,840
uh

2069
01:27:44,229 --> 01:27:42,800
and then you know he becomes

2070
01:27:46,390 --> 01:27:44,239
international director when john

2071
01:27:49,110 --> 01:27:46,400
schussler was just not able to do it

2072
01:27:50,950 --> 01:27:49,120
anymore um john was a great guy

2073
01:27:52,709 --> 01:27:50,960
but anyway so james

2074
01:27:55,270 --> 01:27:52,719
did that for a few years and did make

2075
01:27:56,470 --> 01:27:55,280
waves uh this is just historical record

2076
01:27:59,430 --> 01:27:56,480
like james

2077
01:28:02,870 --> 01:27:59,440
was clearly a very skeptical

2078
01:28:04,550 --> 01:28:02,880
director of mufon even back then people

2079
01:28:06,390 --> 01:28:04,560
like i think after a year or two was

2080
01:28:08,149 --> 01:28:06,400
very evident to me as an outsider i was

2081
01:28:09,830 --> 01:28:08,159
never a member of you mufon

2082
01:28:12,149 --> 01:28:09,840
that there were a lot of unhappy mufon

2083
01:28:15,030 --> 01:28:12,159
members with james he had an attitude

2084
01:28:17,430 --> 01:28:15,040
about roswell where he was really uh

2085
01:28:19,189 --> 01:28:17,440
coming up with a very like non-et

2086
01:28:20,550 --> 01:28:19,199
explanation for that that made a lot of

2087
01:28:22,310 --> 01:28:20,560
folks unhappy

2088
01:28:24,550 --> 01:28:22,320
so james you know was his own guy he had

2089
01:28:25,990 --> 01:28:24,560
his own perspective on this and i can

2090
01:28:27,270 --> 01:28:26,000
respect that

2091
01:28:28,790 --> 01:28:27,280
um

2092
01:28:30,709 --> 01:28:28,800
but yeah he and then he left the field

2093
01:28:32,709 --> 01:28:30,719
and really

2094
01:28:34,070 --> 01:28:32,719
to my perspective

2095
01:28:35,510 --> 01:28:34,080
seemed to have a chip on his shoulder

2096
01:28:37,350 --> 01:28:35,520
against ufology i mean i'm just gonna

2097
01:28:39,270 --> 01:28:37,360
say that and again this is not me trying

2098
01:28:40,390 --> 01:28:39,280
to demean him in any way but that was

2099
01:28:42,390 --> 01:28:40,400
always my impression that he had

2100
01:28:44,950 --> 01:28:42,400
something against ufology

2101
01:28:47,189 --> 01:28:44,960
and he certainly continued that in his

2102
01:28:50,229 --> 01:28:47,199
statements in episode three you know

2103
01:28:52,950 --> 01:28:50,239
he said uh uh some pretty remarkable

2104
01:28:55,350 --> 01:28:52,960
religion i think yes he he

2105
01:28:57,510 --> 01:28:55,360
uh a couple of times which is really

2106
01:28:59,669 --> 01:28:57,520
demeaning actually that's really

2107
01:29:01,110 --> 01:28:59,679
essentially calling it a religion and

2108
01:29:02,229 --> 01:29:01,120
stating that like

2109
01:29:05,270 --> 01:29:02,239
you know the researchers are not

2110
01:29:10,070 --> 01:29:08,149
so he negotiates this deal uh with big

2111
01:29:12,310 --> 01:29:10,080
elections

2112
01:29:16,550 --> 01:29:12,320
and and this was the point

2113
01:29:18,070 --> 01:29:16,560
um a tip goes through this is 2007 it

2114
01:29:19,030 --> 01:29:18,080
gets funded

2115
01:29:21,510 --> 01:29:19,040
um

2116
01:29:23,350 --> 01:29:21,520
he confronts bigelow

2117
01:29:25,830 --> 01:29:23,360
that uh he wants to know with the

2118
01:29:28,950 --> 01:29:25,840
funding coming from

2119
01:29:30,629 --> 01:29:28,960
uh bigelow into mufon if it was coming

2120
01:29:32,629 --> 01:29:30,639
from an agency

2121
01:29:33,510 --> 01:29:32,639
yeah this is a really key connection

2122
01:29:35,990 --> 01:29:33,520
here

2123
01:29:38,070 --> 01:29:36,000
so like with with atip we all know about

2124
01:29:40,629 --> 01:29:38,080
a tip and bigelow's the contractor and

2125
01:29:43,110 --> 01:29:40,639
we all remember that at the same time

2126
01:29:45,350 --> 01:29:43,120
mufon was contracting with bigelow and

2127
01:29:47,430 --> 01:29:45,360
what bigelow wanted from mufon at least

2128
01:29:48,950 --> 01:29:47,440
this was my understanding and

2129
01:29:51,590 --> 01:29:48,960
james carrion didn't really contradict

2130
01:29:54,229 --> 01:29:51,600
this bigelow wanted access to

2131
01:29:56,629 --> 01:29:54,239
uh current sightings immediately

2132
01:29:58,629 --> 01:29:56,639
immediately right like they would go out

2133
01:30:00,149 --> 01:29:58,639
they would send out these teams within

2134
01:30:03,350 --> 01:30:00,159
24 hours

2135
01:30:05,750 --> 01:30:03,360
collect the data and the choice stuff

2136
01:30:07,430 --> 01:30:05,760
would get written up and sent to bigelow

2137
01:30:09,990 --> 01:30:07,440
yeah bigelow is basically data mining

2138
01:30:12,229 --> 01:30:10,000
mufon and i mean that seems as part of

2139
01:30:13,750 --> 01:30:12,239
that was part of his atip contract

2140
01:30:15,110 --> 01:30:13,760
like that

2141
01:30:16,390 --> 01:30:15,120
if we ever had any doubt that there was

2142
01:30:17,590 --> 01:30:16,400
a connection i think this episode

2143
01:30:19,750 --> 01:30:17,600
confirmed that this was a direct

2144
01:30:21,350 --> 01:30:19,760
connection because james carrion's

2145
01:30:23,510 --> 01:30:21,360
talking about this and he's asking

2146
01:30:25,430 --> 01:30:23,520
bigelow directly where's this money

2147
01:30:27,590 --> 01:30:25,440
coming from right and bigelow of course

2148
01:30:29,030 --> 01:30:27,600
wouldn't tell him ninja can't carry and

2149
01:30:31,430 --> 01:30:29,040
apparently said is this coming from the

2150
01:30:33,030 --> 01:30:31,440
government and and he said that bigelow

2151
01:30:35,669 --> 01:30:33,040
denied that so that bigelow lied

2152
01:30:38,310 --> 01:30:35,679
basically he said a bigelow uh gave him

2153
01:30:41,110 --> 01:30:38,320
a direct answer and said no

2154
01:30:44,310 --> 01:30:41,120
that's right yeah yep yep okay let's let

2155
01:30:48,870 --> 01:30:44,320
this this episode three

2156
01:30:51,189 --> 01:30:48,880
was crazy town for me and it was the

2157
01:30:54,709 --> 01:30:51,199
opposite in my opinion

2158
01:30:57,830 --> 01:30:54,719
of what jj abrams started to present in

2159
01:30:59,430 --> 01:30:57,840
episode one we get to episode three yeah

2160
01:31:02,790 --> 01:30:59,440
and now

2161
01:31:04,870 --> 01:31:02,800
abrams is suggesting i'm just saying you

2162
01:31:07,750 --> 01:31:04,880
watch the episode yourself

2163
01:31:11,270 --> 01:31:07,760
that all of this may be

2164
01:31:14,870 --> 01:31:13,189
a big psyop and we're going to discuss

2165
01:31:17,430 --> 01:31:14,880
all of this when we come back after this

2166
01:31:18,790 --> 01:31:17,440
short break this is fade to black i am

2167
01:31:20,709 --> 01:31:18,800
your host jimmy church tonight richard

2168
01:31:23,350 --> 01:31:20,719
nolan and i

2169
01:31:27,030 --> 01:31:23,360
are doing a full analysis and review of

2170
01:31:28,550 --> 01:31:27,040
showtime's new series ufo by jj abrams

2171
01:31:36,590 --> 01:31:28,560
i'm your host jimmy church this is fade

2172
01:31:36,600 --> 01:31:47,189
[Music]

2173
01:31:53,430 --> 01:31:50,310
way out here we listen to jimmy church

2174
01:31:55,270 --> 01:31:53,440
you're listening to fade to black

2175
01:31:57,910 --> 01:31:55,280
always on the edge of the hottest

2176
01:32:03,830 --> 01:31:57,920
alternative talk jimmy church with fade

2177
01:32:03,840 --> 01:32:15,270
[Applause]

2178
01:32:19,990 --> 01:32:17,350
do you want to be an official fate or

2179
01:32:22,310 --> 01:32:20,000
not of course you do this is jimmy

2180
01:32:23,510 --> 01:32:22,320
churchill fade to black just go to our

2181
01:32:26,070 --> 01:32:23,520
membership section at

2182
01:32:28,310 --> 01:32:26,080
jimmychurchradio.com

2183
01:32:30,470 --> 01:32:28,320
this is jimmy church and i invite you to

2184
01:32:33,270 --> 01:32:30,480
attend the 20th annual los angeles

2185
01:32:36,390 --> 01:32:33,280
conscious life expo live and in person

2186
01:32:39,030 --> 01:32:36,400
this september 17th 18th and 19th at the

2187
01:32:41,270 --> 01:32:39,040
lax airport hilton connect with

2188
01:32:43,750 --> 01:32:41,280
exhibitors community thought leaders and

2189
01:32:45,990 --> 01:32:43,760
friends as we begin to recreate the

2190
01:32:48,310 --> 01:32:46,000
world you can also watch the expo from

2191
01:32:50,310 --> 01:32:48,320
the comfort of your own home live stream

2192
01:32:52,709 --> 01:32:50,320
from the main stage in los angeles and

2193
01:32:55,110 --> 01:32:52,719
from the main stage in london truly a

2194
01:32:57,830 --> 01:32:55,120
global simulcast event broadcast around

2195
01:33:00,229 --> 01:32:57,840
the world live stream and in-person expo

2196
01:33:02,550 --> 01:33:00,239
tickets are available now i'll be your

2197
01:33:04,950 --> 01:33:02,560
host all weekend long from los angeles

2198
01:33:07,510 --> 01:33:04,960
and on friday it's my ancient secrets

2199
01:33:10,310 --> 01:33:07,520
and earth mysteries themed segment with

2200
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james keenan caroline corey and william

2201
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henry and on saturday daniel sheen and i

2202
01:33:19,270 --> 01:33:16,480
sit down for a one-on-one interview live

2203
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we have an amazing lineup of 25 speakers

2204
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including bashar gail thackeray kimberly

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meredith whitley strieber stephen

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bassett daniel brinkley and lisa garr

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consciouslifeexpo.com for tickets and

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vader knots when you think about the

2213
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future of our country and where we're

2214
01:33:47,030 --> 01:33:43,920
headed do you wonder about the food

2215
01:33:49,189 --> 01:33:47,040
supply i do disruptions in the food

2216
01:33:51,990 --> 01:33:49,199
supply chain could be disastrous and

2217
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they usually occur with little warning

2218
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that's why the smartest thing you can do

2219
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today is to stockpile emergency food

2220
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water and other essentials i personally

2221
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recommend my patriot supply they're the

2222
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nation's largest emergency preparedness

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for more than a decade in fact they're

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the only source my family trusts for our

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preparedness plan you should too right

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now save 20 off a full four week supply

2228
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of delicious meals that provide 2 000

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calories a day saving 20 helps too

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doesn't it especially now so go to

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prepare with jimmy.com and get ready

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time to lose

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[Music]

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kgraradio.com

2248
01:35:29,270 --> 01:35:24,470
you are listening to fate to black with

2249
01:35:31,830 --> 01:35:29,280
jimmy church on the game changer network

2250
01:35:34,709 --> 01:35:31,840
hi i'm rhys evans you're listening to

2251
01:35:37,590 --> 01:35:34,719
jimmy church this is revolution the

2252
01:35:40,870 --> 01:35:37,600
revolution will not be televised the

2253
01:35:44,580 --> 01:35:40,880
revolution is on radio

2254
01:36:24,950 --> 01:36:14,650
[Music]

2255
01:36:27,910 --> 01:36:26,709
all right welcome back fade to black i

2256
01:36:29,830 --> 01:36:27,920
am your host jimmy church tonight

2257
01:36:32,149 --> 01:36:29,840
richard dolan is here we are doing a

2258
01:36:36,790 --> 01:36:32,159
full analysis and review

2259
01:36:38,470 --> 01:36:36,800
of showtime's ufo by jj abrams

2260
01:36:39,590 --> 01:36:38,480
more with richard in just a second i

2261
01:36:42,629 --> 01:36:39,600
just got to jump in and talk to you

2262
01:36:44,870 --> 01:36:42,639
about virtual shield virtual shield vpn

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you've got to get your own vpn you've

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maybe you want to watch something that

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is not available

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in in in your country i'm just saying

2269
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you can do that with a vpn like uh

2270
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ross colthardt or showtime

2271
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they they just put up ufo nobody could

2272
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see it in other countries and then i

2273
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started to see yeah but i've got uh

2274
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virtual shield vpn i saw the comments

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they were able to watch it don't you

2276
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get virtual shield vpn today it's all

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to enjoy

2288
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ufo by showtime that we are reviewing

2289
01:37:49,990 --> 01:37:46,000
right now richard

2290
01:37:51,430 --> 01:37:50,000
now um going back to

2291
01:37:53,030 --> 01:37:51,440
carrion

2292
01:37:54,629 --> 01:37:53,040
and uh

2293
01:38:00,390 --> 01:37:54,639
he

2294
01:38:02,070 --> 01:38:00,400
presents in a very direct fashion

2295
01:38:09,750 --> 01:38:02,080
his

2296
01:38:12,229 --> 01:38:09,760
was that he was invited out to tabas to

2297
01:38:13,189 --> 01:38:12,239
bigelow aerospace he drives out he goes

2298
01:38:21,109 --> 01:38:13,199
in

2299
01:38:23,910 --> 01:38:21,119
um and

2300
01:38:25,990 --> 01:38:23,920
uh i the names escaped me now but i

2301
01:38:27,510 --> 01:38:26,000
think he said put off was there cut off

2302
01:38:29,669 --> 01:38:27,520
in valet yeah

2303
01:38:32,550 --> 01:38:29,679
jacques valet and he said a couple of

2304
01:38:34,550 --> 01:38:32,560
other people that he didn't recognize

2305
01:38:36,070 --> 01:38:34,560
that's right yeah so like they were i

2306
01:38:38,470 --> 01:38:36,080
mean they were presented in the show as

2307
01:38:40,229 --> 01:38:38,480
mysterious maybe they were

2308
01:38:43,669 --> 01:38:40,239
maybe they were not we really we don't

2309
01:38:45,510 --> 01:38:43,679
know and uh and and he's there with uh

2310
01:38:47,430 --> 01:38:45,520
his team from mufon

2311
01:38:51,030 --> 01:38:47,440
um i went back and did some research

2312
01:38:53,910 --> 01:38:51,040
about who was with james but it was uh

2313
01:38:55,910 --> 01:38:53,920
the normal uh mufon team and that was uh

2314
01:38:59,590 --> 01:38:55,920
pretty interesting so he goes and he

2315
01:39:00,950 --> 01:38:59,600
negotiates this deal it's 50 000 a month

2316
01:39:03,510 --> 01:39:00,960
uh

2317
01:39:05,910 --> 01:39:03,520
forever right like

2318
01:39:08,629 --> 01:39:05,920
forever this was going to be

2319
01:39:10,470 --> 01:39:08,639
uh contribute and i i just always

2320
01:39:12,950 --> 01:39:10,480
thought about and and going back to

2321
01:39:15,109 --> 01:39:12,960
those that fifty thousand dollars isn't

2322
01:39:17,590 --> 01:39:15,119
a whole lot of money

2323
01:39:20,390 --> 01:39:17,600
coming from a billionaire

2324
01:39:23,270 --> 01:39:20,400
and if it came from this 22 million

2325
01:39:25,910 --> 01:39:23,280
dollar fund uh that was a tip

2326
01:39:29,109 --> 01:39:25,920
um that's another thing bigelow said it

2327
01:39:31,750 --> 01:39:29,119
was an anonymous supporter

2328
01:39:33,669 --> 01:39:31,760
right that right yeah that's essentially

2329
01:39:36,629 --> 01:39:33,679
right that's how it was portrayed in the

2330
01:39:38,870 --> 01:39:36,639
show now um and you think about it from

2331
01:39:40,550 --> 01:39:38,880
that point of view like 50 000 wouldn't

2332
01:39:42,070 --> 01:39:40,560
be a lot to a lot of organizations but

2333
01:39:43,590 --> 01:39:42,080
first of all mufon has always been on a

2334
01:39:45,430 --> 01:39:43,600
shoestring budget

2335
01:39:47,510 --> 01:39:45,440
and then from bigelow's point of view

2336
01:39:48,950 --> 01:39:47,520
like you just have to say

2337
01:39:50,229 --> 01:39:48,960
if you're robert bigelow you want to

2338
01:39:53,430 --> 01:39:50,239
fund mufon how much are you going to

2339
01:39:55,430 --> 01:39:53,440
really trust mufon to do a great job

2340
01:39:56,470 --> 01:39:55,440
with this it's not like they've got bad

2341
01:39:58,130 --> 01:39:56,480
people

2342
01:39:59,510 --> 01:39:58,140
but but mufon

2343
01:40:00,310 --> 01:39:59,520
[Music]

2344
01:40:05,990 --> 01:40:00,320
like

2345
01:40:07,590 --> 01:40:06,000
serious training and dedication

2346
01:40:10,070 --> 01:40:07,600
and trust

2347
01:40:11,669 --> 01:40:10,080
to put a lot more money

2348
01:40:13,189 --> 01:40:11,679
to think you're going to get you know

2349
01:40:15,590 --> 01:40:13,199
what what would you expect to get out of

2350
01:40:16,550 --> 01:40:15,600
it and the idea was and in fact this i

2351
01:40:17,910 --> 01:40:16,560
know

2352
01:40:19,270 --> 01:40:17,920
was one of the complaints that bigelow

2353
01:40:21,030 --> 01:40:19,280
had in the aftermath he was like his

2354
01:40:22,310 --> 01:40:21,040
attitude is referring this money and

2355
01:40:24,070 --> 01:40:22,320
move fun and we're not getting anything

2356
01:40:26,070 --> 01:40:24,080
really professional out of them

2357
01:40:28,550 --> 01:40:26,080
and i mean so you get this acrimony that

2358
01:40:30,790 --> 01:40:28,560
happens in the in the whole breakup

2359
01:40:32,070 --> 01:40:30,800
of that relationship but you know you

2360
01:40:33,510 --> 01:40:32,080
could definitely

2361
01:40:36,149 --> 01:40:33,520
see like

2362
01:40:37,669 --> 01:40:36,159
if if i were funding mufon i i would

2363
01:40:39,270 --> 01:40:37,679
want to make sure that i want to get my

2364
01:40:41,109 --> 01:40:39,280
money's worth if i'm going to throw it

2365
01:40:43,669 --> 01:40:41,119
more than 50k down a month

2366
01:40:45,030 --> 01:40:43,679
now and um

2367
01:40:47,189 --> 01:40:45,040
carrion

2368
01:40:49,030 --> 01:40:47,199
says a couple of remarkable things at

2369
01:40:52,470 --> 01:40:49,040
this point one

2370
01:40:55,270 --> 01:40:52,480
was that bigelow would then have access

2371
01:40:58,149 --> 01:40:55,280
to the mufon database number one

2372
01:41:01,030 --> 01:40:58,159
uh number two he would have access to

2373
01:41:03,990 --> 01:41:01,040
the best cases and but that number three

2374
01:41:06,550 --> 01:41:04,000
that move fund and its members were

2375
01:41:08,870 --> 01:41:06,560
there because this was independent of

2376
01:41:11,030 --> 01:41:08,880
the government it was a civilian-based

2377
01:41:13,669 --> 01:41:11,040
organization from the word go

2378
01:41:16,790 --> 01:41:13,679
uh from the way that it was

2379
01:41:18,310 --> 01:41:16,800
uh intended to be going back to 1969

2380
01:41:22,390 --> 01:41:18,320
1970

2381
01:41:24,149 --> 01:41:22,400
um and and that the people the members

2382
01:41:26,790 --> 01:41:24,159
of mufon

2383
01:41:31,109 --> 01:41:26,800
would probably freak out if they found

2384
01:41:34,070 --> 01:41:31,119
out that their cases were being shared

2385
01:41:35,830 --> 01:41:34,080
with the possibility of a secret

2386
01:41:37,189 --> 01:41:35,840
government organization that was

2387
01:41:38,390 --> 01:41:37,199
propping up

2388
01:41:40,310 --> 01:41:38,400
bigelow

2389
01:41:42,070 --> 01:41:40,320
and now you're bringing out accurate

2390
01:41:44,149 --> 01:41:42,080
history but this none of this was really

2391
01:41:45,990 --> 01:41:44,159
portrayed very clearly in the show i

2392
01:41:46,790 --> 01:41:46,000
mean i would just make that case you

2393
01:41:48,950 --> 01:41:46,800
know

2394
01:41:51,910 --> 01:41:48,960
like there was a different angle

2395
01:41:53,669 --> 01:41:51,920
that was given the angle that

2396
01:41:54,950 --> 01:41:53,679
you're saying and that i agree with i

2397
01:41:57,510 --> 01:41:54,960
mean i just i look at that whole

2398
01:42:00,070 --> 01:41:57,520
arrangement as bigelow data mining mufon

2399
01:42:01,510 --> 01:42:00,080
as part of the a-tip contract which

2400
01:42:03,030 --> 01:42:01,520
which actually makes sense like if

2401
01:42:04,790 --> 01:42:03,040
you're bigelow

2402
01:42:06,950 --> 01:42:04,800
that would make perfect sense you know

2403
01:42:08,950 --> 01:42:06,960
you're you're gathering information for

2404
01:42:09,990 --> 01:42:08,960
guys like lou elizondo and the folks at

2405
01:42:11,590 --> 01:42:10,000
atip

2406
01:42:13,109 --> 01:42:11,600
and so what do you want to do well one

2407
01:42:14,550 --> 01:42:13,119
thing you'll do is you'll hire pot off

2408
01:42:15,910 --> 01:42:14,560
to

2409
01:42:17,990 --> 01:42:15,920
uh

2410
01:42:19,590 --> 01:42:18,000
you know requisition advanced scientific

2411
01:42:20,390 --> 01:42:19,600
papers from scientists around the world

2412
01:42:21,830 --> 01:42:20,400
on

2413
01:42:23,910 --> 01:42:21,840
future science and apparently they did

2414
01:42:25,189 --> 01:42:23,920
the same thing with mufon

2415
01:42:26,790 --> 01:42:25,199
uh yes

2416
01:42:28,629 --> 01:42:26,800
but but then you would also you would

2417
01:42:31,030 --> 01:42:28,639
want to connect with mufon just to see

2418
01:42:32,950 --> 01:42:31,040
like what's mufon getting what cases are

2419
01:42:35,109 --> 01:42:32,960
they getting that would be of scientific

2420
01:42:36,470 --> 01:42:35,119
value to to research

2421
01:42:38,550 --> 01:42:36,480
like that actually would make perfect

2422
01:42:39,910 --> 01:42:38,560
sense if you're bigelow working on this

2423
01:42:43,109 --> 01:42:39,920
contract

2424
01:42:45,350 --> 01:42:43,119
don't you think so well it and it's uh

2425
01:42:46,950 --> 01:42:45,360
the answer the short and quick answer is

2426
01:42:48,629 --> 01:42:46,960
of course yes

2427
01:42:50,629 --> 01:42:48,639
but then there was another statement

2428
01:42:52,550 --> 01:42:50,639
from james carrion

2429
01:42:56,870 --> 01:42:52,560
um and we haven't heard from james in

2430
01:42:58,790 --> 01:42:56,880
years right like i i don't know uh

2431
01:43:01,430 --> 01:42:58,800
how they chased him down and convinced

2432
01:43:03,590 --> 01:43:01,440
him uh to come out it's a blog yeah he

2433
01:43:05,030 --> 01:43:03,600
does have a blog and i i went back and

2434
01:43:06,629 --> 01:43:05,040
read a bunch of it

2435
01:43:08,790 --> 01:43:06,639
and it's all about

2436
01:43:11,590 --> 01:43:08,800
the cia and intelligence but that's

2437
01:43:13,910 --> 01:43:11,600
another discussion later nothing on his

2438
01:43:15,430 --> 01:43:13,920
blog about ufos that i saw

2439
01:43:17,669 --> 01:43:15,440
um and i found that interesting but

2440
01:43:19,590 --> 01:43:17,679
anyway so going back to his statement

2441
01:43:21,109 --> 01:43:19,600
which was

2442
01:43:28,149 --> 01:43:21,119
the

2443
01:43:30,470 --> 01:43:28,159
ttsa

2444
01:43:32,790 --> 01:43:30,480
and having i would be careful about that

2445
01:43:33,830 --> 01:43:32,800
but this is what it did not fold into t

2446
01:43:36,070 --> 01:43:33,840
but this is

2447
01:43:36,870 --> 01:43:36,080
that's not me saying it this is what he

2448
01:43:41,430 --> 01:43:36,880
said

2449
01:43:45,350 --> 01:43:41,440
is an op

2450
01:43:47,750 --> 01:43:45,360
correct that is how and and so if

2451
01:43:49,270 --> 01:43:47,760
anybody is in a position to make this

2452
01:43:52,950 --> 01:43:49,280
kind of comment

2453
01:43:56,070 --> 01:43:52,960
is james carrion qualified to go that

2454
01:43:58,550 --> 01:43:56,080
far into colleges in his opinion

2455
01:44:00,390 --> 01:43:58,560
anyone can have an opinion but did he i

2456
01:44:01,590 --> 01:44:00,400
don't recall this but in the show did he

2457
01:44:03,510 --> 01:44:01,600
actually

2458
01:44:05,270 --> 01:44:03,520
offer what his opinion of what the op

2459
01:44:07,189 --> 01:44:05,280
actually was

2460
01:44:09,270 --> 01:44:07,199
i mean he offered the opinion that in

2461
01:44:10,790 --> 01:44:09,280
the early years the op was to fake out

2462
01:44:12,310 --> 01:44:10,800
the soviets as part of the cold war in

2463
01:44:14,229 --> 01:44:12,320
fact it wasn't just him there was a

2464
01:44:16,229 --> 01:44:14,239
woman she taught in um

2465
01:44:17,990 --> 01:44:16,239
is it penn state i can't remember her

2466
01:44:19,830 --> 01:44:18,000
name cole

2467
01:44:22,149 --> 01:44:19,840
can't remember her name

2468
01:44:24,390 --> 01:44:22,159
they had this other person oh oh in in

2469
01:44:25,270 --> 01:44:24,400
the series

2470
01:44:27,189 --> 01:44:25,280
yeah yeah

2471
01:44:28,870 --> 01:44:27,199
and she was uh she was pretty

2472
01:44:30,870 --> 01:44:28,880
interesting and pretty well versed in

2473
01:44:33,510 --> 01:44:30,880
ufo lore and history i found her very

2474
01:44:34,229 --> 01:44:33,520
dismissive of ufo research in general

2475
01:44:39,510 --> 01:44:34,239
yes

2476
01:44:43,990 --> 01:44:39,520
dismissive that was easy to read with

2477
01:44:46,310 --> 01:44:44,000
her but this is what uh again

2478
01:44:48,950 --> 01:44:46,320
in in watching episode three which i've

2479
01:44:51,430 --> 01:44:48,960
seen twice i've seen episode

2480
01:44:53,350 --> 01:44:51,440
uh three three times now i've seen

2481
01:44:55,510 --> 01:44:53,360
episode four twice

2482
01:44:56,790 --> 01:44:55,520
um is that just think you're better than

2483
01:44:58,470 --> 01:44:56,800
everyone else because you've seen it so

2484
01:45:01,350 --> 01:44:58,480
many times that's right

2485
01:45:06,070 --> 01:45:01,360
i'm definitive man i'm definitive

2486
01:45:08,390 --> 01:45:06,080
is that what they were a jj abrams was

2487
01:45:09,990 --> 01:45:08,400
trying to project

2488
01:45:12,950 --> 01:45:10,000
is that

2489
01:45:18,070 --> 01:45:15,350
in any fashion

2490
01:45:19,270 --> 01:45:18,080
are there as a necessity for the

2491
01:45:21,109 --> 01:45:19,280
government

2492
01:45:22,709 --> 01:45:21,119
to have a cover

2493
01:45:26,629 --> 01:45:22,719
for their

2494
01:45:29,590 --> 01:45:26,639
technology and the terrestrial aspect of

2495
01:45:31,430 --> 01:45:29,600
what the reality of ufos are that would

2496
01:45:33,030 --> 01:45:31,440
make that claim but it's total utter

2497
01:45:35,189 --> 01:45:33,040
nonsense and i'm going to tell you why

2498
01:45:38,310 --> 01:45:35,199
well but do you agree that that's what

2499
01:45:40,390 --> 01:45:38,320
episode three tried to say yes yes i

2500
01:45:42,390 --> 01:45:40,400
agree that's what it tried to say

2501
01:45:44,870 --> 01:45:42,400
and it's and you know the here's the

2502
01:45:47,189 --> 01:45:44,880
irony of that episode they're all

2503
01:45:50,470 --> 01:45:47,199
talking about disinformation

2504
01:45:53,189 --> 01:45:50,480
that episode was disinformation

2505
01:45:54,470 --> 01:45:53,199
all right that episode

2506
01:45:56,790 --> 01:45:54,480
to me

2507
01:45:59,510 --> 01:45:56,800
i watched that i'm i thought i'm i'm

2508
01:46:01,910 --> 01:45:59,520
watching this information here

2509
01:46:04,550 --> 01:46:01,920
because when you because it none of it

2510
01:46:06,950 --> 01:46:04,560
is genuinely historical the history that

2511
01:46:09,109 --> 01:46:06,960
was presented there was so skewed so

2512
01:46:11,270 --> 01:46:09,119
inaccurate i would actually at times i

2513
01:46:13,109 --> 01:46:11,280
would say dishonest and that's a harsh

2514
01:46:15,030 --> 01:46:13,119
thing to say and it sounds like an

2515
01:46:17,270 --> 01:46:15,040
accusation

2516
01:46:19,750 --> 01:46:17,280
and maybe it wasn't intentionally

2517
01:46:21,830 --> 01:46:19,760
dishonest maybe it wasn't i i can't no

2518
01:46:24,149 --> 01:46:21,840
i'm not inside their heads

2519
01:46:25,350 --> 01:46:24,159
but i will say when you're making the

2520
01:46:26,629 --> 01:46:25,360
case

2521
01:46:28,870 --> 01:46:26,639
that

2522
01:46:31,510 --> 01:46:28,880
the us has got this secret black budget

2523
01:46:33,109 --> 01:46:31,520
tech that's super advanced

2524
01:46:35,270 --> 01:46:33,119
sci-fi advanced

2525
01:46:36,390 --> 01:46:35,280
and you're using it to

2526
01:46:38,470 --> 01:46:36,400
basically

2527
01:46:40,709 --> 01:46:38,480
harass your own navy which was

2528
01:46:42,149 --> 01:46:40,719
absolutely suggested for the nimitz

2529
01:46:44,070 --> 01:46:42,159
incident

2530
01:46:46,310 --> 01:46:44,080
well let's just wind the clock back a

2531
01:46:50,070 --> 01:46:46,320
little bit let's go back to the 1990s

2532
01:46:51,510 --> 01:46:50,080
1980s 1960s 1950s 1940s

2533
01:46:53,030 --> 01:46:51,520
are you going to is anyone really going

2534
01:46:55,109 --> 01:46:53,040
to suggest

2535
01:46:56,709 --> 01:46:55,119
that the united states has had a black

2536
01:46:58,470 --> 01:46:56,719
budget world that has

2537
01:47:00,950 --> 01:46:58,480
that invented flying saucers in the

2538
01:47:03,030 --> 01:47:00,960
1940s and has been pissing off the navy

2539
01:47:05,189 --> 01:47:03,040
and the air force ever since and no

2540
01:47:09,590 --> 01:47:05,199
one's the wiser

2541
01:47:11,990 --> 01:47:09,600
like and and violating airspace uh over

2542
01:47:13,910 --> 01:47:12,000
sensitive locations dealing with nukes

2543
01:47:15,590 --> 01:47:13,920
again and again and again and again oh

2544
01:47:17,750 --> 01:47:15,600
yeah and by the way doing it over the

2545
01:47:19,590 --> 01:47:17,760
soviet union too and just

2546
01:47:21,750 --> 01:47:19,600
getting them worked up and over every

2547
01:47:23,109 --> 01:47:21,760
other country in the world in the 1940s

2548
01:47:24,629 --> 01:47:23,119
and 50s

2549
01:47:26,870 --> 01:47:24,639
i mean because

2550
01:47:28,629 --> 01:47:26,880
don't cherry-pick the damn information

2551
01:47:30,310 --> 01:47:28,639
which is what they're doing here and

2552
01:47:32,310 --> 01:47:30,320
it's dishonest

2553
01:47:33,590 --> 01:47:32,320
it's misleading

2554
01:47:34,950 --> 01:47:33,600
and

2555
01:47:36,310 --> 01:47:34,960
you know this is part of the problem

2556
01:47:38,470 --> 01:47:36,320
where like everyone's pretending like

2557
01:47:41,510 --> 01:47:38,480
ufos were invented in 2004 for god's

2558
01:47:43,910 --> 01:47:41,520
sake and that's not so

2559
01:47:46,390 --> 01:47:43,920
there are objects of equal if not even

2560
01:47:49,109 --> 01:47:46,400
sometimes greater capabilities than the

2561
01:47:51,830 --> 01:47:49,119
tic tac that were recorded in the 1940s

2562
01:47:54,390 --> 01:47:51,840
we have reports of objects

2563
01:47:56,950 --> 01:47:54,400
19 there's one example white sands april

2564
01:47:59,030 --> 01:47:56,960
1949 your navy is launching a missile

2565
01:48:01,510 --> 01:47:59,040
out of white sands it achieves a speed

2566
01:48:05,669 --> 01:48:01,520
of 1300 miles per hour at which point

2567
01:48:06,870 --> 01:48:05,679
this is being filmed okay

2568
01:48:11,910 --> 01:48:06,880
object

2569
01:48:13,830 --> 01:48:11,920
circle around the missile

2570
01:48:16,550 --> 01:48:13,840
as it achieves a speed

2571
01:48:18,310 --> 01:48:16,560
they seem to merge and then fly off and

2572
01:48:20,870 --> 01:48:18,320
i can't remember if that was a missile

2573
01:48:23,109 --> 01:48:20,880
that crashed or not no that wasn't but

2574
01:48:25,350 --> 01:48:23,119
there were other examples uh i think an

2575
01:48:27,510 --> 01:48:25,360
atlas missile in 1964 where it did

2576
01:48:29,109 --> 01:48:27,520
actually crash after another ufo was

2577
01:48:31,350 --> 01:48:29,119
filmed going around that one and i think

2578
01:48:33,910 --> 01:48:31,360
that was vandenberg yes

2579
01:48:36,550 --> 01:48:33,920
and these things happen so

2580
01:48:38,390 --> 01:48:36,560
let's let's like look at this the grand

2581
01:48:40,709 --> 01:48:38,400
evidence here

2582
01:48:43,270 --> 01:48:40,719
and and then make an assessment rather

2583
01:48:45,270 --> 01:48:43,280
than just pick the little facts that fit

2584
01:48:47,590 --> 01:48:45,280
your narrative of the story that you're

2585
01:48:50,390 --> 01:48:47,600
trying to tell the world i i consider

2586
01:48:51,830 --> 01:48:50,400
that narrative to be disinformation

2587
01:48:53,189 --> 01:48:51,840
and you know it really it starts to

2588
01:48:54,550 --> 01:48:53,199
annoy me because

2589
01:48:56,149 --> 01:48:54,560
i hear over the last few years

2590
01:48:57,669 --> 01:48:56,159
everyone's saying disinformation they're

2591
01:48:59,669 --> 01:48:57,679
hiding something well you know what

2592
01:49:02,070 --> 01:48:59,679
maybe that maybe

2593
01:49:03,430 --> 01:49:02,080
that argument is the disinformation

2594
01:49:04,950 --> 01:49:03,440
no because maybe there is something here

2595
01:49:06,310 --> 01:49:04,960
that doesn't belong to us

2596
01:49:09,109 --> 01:49:06,320
and ever you got these folks trying to

2597
01:49:11,350 --> 01:49:09,119
say oh it's our own tech bs i'm calling

2598
01:49:14,629 --> 01:49:11,360
i'm calling on that well you

2599
01:49:18,229 --> 01:49:14,639
know if you go back to episode one and

2600
01:49:20,390 --> 01:49:18,239
you've got diana pasulka who was great

2601
01:49:22,310 --> 01:49:20,400
and presenting the religious narrative

2602
01:49:25,589 --> 01:49:22,320
of this going back to angels and

2603
01:49:29,270 --> 01:49:25,599
invisibility of these beings and how uh

2604
01:49:31,750 --> 01:49:29,280
the vatican continued to uh correct and

2605
01:49:34,310 --> 01:49:31,760
adjust you know not only the historical

2606
01:49:35,910 --> 01:49:34,320
side of this but the way that it is

2607
01:49:38,790 --> 01:49:35,920
being presented today that the

2608
01:49:41,350 --> 01:49:38,800
phenomenon is real and it goes back

2609
01:49:44,149 --> 01:49:41,360
thousands of years and has been reported

2610
01:49:46,229 --> 01:49:44,159
throughout history the only only problem

2611
01:49:48,390 --> 01:49:46,239
with with her appearance on the show i

2612
01:49:50,070 --> 01:49:48,400
had nothing against diana posalka at all

2613
01:49:52,390 --> 01:49:50,080
i thought she was very cogent she's very

2614
01:49:54,070 --> 01:49:52,400
intelligent everything she said

2615
01:49:56,229 --> 01:49:54,080
was on point

2616
01:49:59,030 --> 01:49:56,239
in relation to the research she does my

2617
01:50:01,830 --> 01:49:59,040
my only quibble is that her inclusion on

2618
01:50:03,589 --> 01:50:01,840
the show didn't in my opinion is just me

2619
01:50:05,750 --> 01:50:03,599
didn't really fit

2620
01:50:08,310 --> 01:50:05,760
uh the content

2621
01:50:09,589 --> 01:50:08,320
of the rest of the show no what she was

2622
01:50:11,030 --> 01:50:09,599
doing was really out in a totally

2623
01:50:13,350 --> 01:50:11,040
different place and i'm not sure it

2624
01:50:16,070 --> 01:50:13,360
really worked but this is my point with

2625
01:50:17,589 --> 01:50:16,080
that though what what jj was setting up

2626
01:50:21,109 --> 01:50:17,599
in the beginning

2627
01:50:23,270 --> 01:50:21,119
is the historical perspective of et's

2628
01:50:27,109 --> 01:50:23,280
visiting earth and this has been going

2629
01:50:29,109 --> 01:50:27,119
on for a long time when you get to with

2630
01:50:30,629 --> 01:50:29,119
no evidence presented during the show to

2631
01:50:32,470 --> 01:50:30,639
that effect i mean it just has to be

2632
01:50:34,709 --> 01:50:32,480
said you have her

2633
01:50:37,189 --> 01:50:34,719
making this statement and yes of course

2634
01:50:38,550 --> 01:50:37,199
we all know there is there is evidence

2635
01:50:40,629 --> 01:50:38,560
or at least there

2636
01:50:41,750 --> 01:50:40,639
there's reason to consider certain

2637
01:50:43,510 --> 01:50:41,760
things as evidence for ancient

2638
01:50:45,669 --> 01:50:43,520
visitation we don't we don't really have

2639
01:50:47,430 --> 01:50:45,679
no one was doing reports five hundred a

2640
01:50:49,350 --> 01:50:47,440
thousand years ago there's there's no

2641
01:50:52,070 --> 01:50:49,360
independent ufo investigation no but

2642
01:50:54,229 --> 01:50:52,080
what they did so they are stories

2643
01:50:56,229 --> 01:50:54,239
but they did show sculpture they did

2644
01:50:57,510 --> 01:50:56,239
show paintings and they showed the way

2645
01:50:59,350 --> 01:50:57,520
that this was

2646
01:51:01,430 --> 01:50:59,360
represented uh

2647
01:51:03,589 --> 01:51:01,440
historically it didn't fit with the rest

2648
01:51:06,709 --> 01:51:03,599
of the narrative i think but it was the

2649
01:51:10,149 --> 01:51:06,719
suggestion in episode one that this was

2650
01:51:12,229 --> 01:51:10,159
an e.t phenomenon that has a historical

2651
01:51:14,390 --> 01:51:12,239
record and and

2652
01:51:16,870 --> 01:51:14,400
something else extraordinary right and

2653
01:51:19,750 --> 01:51:16,880
then you get to episode three

2654
01:51:23,510 --> 01:51:19,760
and you've got a complete flip-flop

2655
01:51:26,550 --> 01:51:23,520
of what jj and his producers did in

2656
01:51:30,790 --> 01:51:28,709
that's the part for me when i called you

2657
01:51:32,550 --> 01:51:30,800
up and i said richard

2658
01:51:34,470 --> 01:51:32,560
you're gonna see episode three man and

2659
01:51:36,390 --> 01:51:34,480
you're you're not going to be happy more

2660
01:51:38,070 --> 01:51:36,400
work for me thanks yes

2661
01:51:40,470 --> 01:51:38,080
and and when i

2662
01:51:42,870 --> 01:51:40,480
when i told you what i thought episode

2663
01:51:45,189 --> 01:51:42,880
three represented i think after seeing

2664
01:51:48,070 --> 01:51:45,199
episode one you almost didn't believe me

2665
01:51:49,910 --> 01:51:48,080
i was like no they they didn't go there

2666
01:51:51,990 --> 01:51:49,920
did i do that i can't remember i don't

2667
01:51:53,270 --> 01:51:52,000
remember anything anymore my brain just

2668
01:51:54,070 --> 01:51:53,280
mushed but

2669
01:51:55,589 --> 01:51:54,080
uh

2670
01:51:57,350 --> 01:51:55,599
no i believed you by the end of our

2671
01:51:58,550 --> 01:51:57,360
conversation i was like okay church is

2672
01:52:01,030 --> 01:51:58,560
onto something here

2673
01:52:02,870 --> 01:52:01,040
and and you were right i mean it was

2674
01:52:05,030 --> 01:52:02,880
yeah it was a very

2675
01:52:06,790 --> 01:52:05,040
episode three was very in your face and

2676
01:52:08,870 --> 01:52:06,800
kind of insulting i just have to say

2677
01:52:12,070 --> 01:52:08,880
like for people who are serious

2678
01:52:13,910 --> 01:52:12,080
researchers in the ufo subject

2679
01:52:16,470 --> 01:52:13,920
uh

2680
01:52:18,709 --> 01:52:16,480
you know some of it just wasn't okay it

2681
01:52:20,950 --> 01:52:18,719
was complimentary to the ufo community

2682
01:52:22,550 --> 01:52:20,960
at all no no and this is okay now i'm

2683
01:52:24,470 --> 01:52:22,560
gonna say something controversial i

2684
01:52:27,990 --> 01:52:24,480
don't know this is fact

2685
01:52:32,470 --> 01:52:28,000
okay i'm only suggesting

2686
01:52:34,390 --> 01:52:32,480
an idea here but it's this

2687
01:52:38,550 --> 01:52:34,400
when you have

2688
01:52:40,350 --> 01:52:38,560
george knapp apparently talking about

2689
01:52:43,350 --> 01:52:40,360
an alternative narrative of

2690
01:52:46,310 --> 01:52:43,360
disinformation suggesting ufos when it

2691
01:52:48,310 --> 01:52:46,320
is a cover-up of u.s tech i question

2692
01:52:50,390 --> 01:52:48,320
that i don't know if that was what

2693
01:52:53,830 --> 01:52:50,400
george actually said

2694
01:52:55,510 --> 01:52:53,840
or was there some clever editing there i

2695
01:52:57,589 --> 01:52:55,520
would love to hear about that yeah i

2696
01:53:00,070 --> 01:52:57,599
would love to hear george's comments and

2697
01:53:01,990 --> 01:53:00,080
the same thing with leslie kane

2698
01:53:03,830 --> 01:53:02,000
and the same thing so they then they

2699
01:53:05,830 --> 01:53:03,840
bring on richard doty

2700
01:53:07,910 --> 01:53:05,840
who talks about you know drones and

2701
01:53:09,830 --> 01:53:07,920
technology and

2702
01:53:12,550 --> 01:53:09,840
the the need to

2703
01:53:16,149 --> 01:53:12,560
inject a ufo narrative into this so we

2704
01:53:18,310 --> 01:53:16,159
can cover up our actual tech we had to

2705
01:53:20,629 --> 01:53:18,320
do that at kirkland there was no way we

2706
01:53:22,950 --> 01:53:20,639
were gonna let the world know that we

2707
01:53:26,709 --> 01:53:22,960
had lasers blinding

2708
01:53:28,470 --> 01:53:26,719
uh uh soviet satellites as they passed

2709
01:53:30,390 --> 01:53:28,480
over kirkland

2710
01:53:32,790 --> 01:53:30,400
no we're going to say that that's ufos

2711
01:53:35,109 --> 01:53:32,800
at kirkland and we're okay with that

2712
01:53:36,950 --> 01:53:35,119
that's the that's the tone there do you

2713
01:53:38,629 --> 01:53:36,960
think that that was

2714
01:53:40,470 --> 01:53:38,639
certainly in the case with george knapp

2715
01:53:42,709 --> 01:53:40,480
and if george if you're listening or

2716
01:53:43,910 --> 01:53:42,719
somebody can reach out to you

2717
01:53:46,790 --> 01:53:43,920
were you

2718
01:53:48,470 --> 01:53:46,800
actually saying that or was that some

2719
01:53:51,109 --> 01:53:48,480
clever editing

2720
01:53:53,109 --> 01:53:51,119
that allowed this because we all know

2721
01:53:54,550 --> 01:53:53,119
you can do that in editing

2722
01:53:56,790 --> 01:53:54,560
and yeah and

2723
01:54:00,550 --> 01:53:56,800
you know you know george i know george

2724
01:54:02,629 --> 01:54:00,560
yes we know leslie to to suggest this in

2725
01:54:04,950 --> 01:54:02,639
the way that they did

2726
01:54:07,350 --> 01:54:04,960
um i don't know if it was a bit of

2727
01:54:09,350 --> 01:54:07,360
dishonest editing i have to say

2728
01:54:11,750 --> 01:54:09,360
uh i mean look when you're sitting in

2729
01:54:13,189 --> 01:54:11,760
front of a camera we've both been there

2730
01:54:14,950 --> 01:54:13,199
you've got no control over how that

2731
01:54:17,350 --> 01:54:14,960
editing process goes like

2732
01:54:19,030 --> 01:54:17,360
and and those those conversations when

2733
01:54:20,790 --> 01:54:19,040
you're being interviewed they can go all

2734
01:54:23,189 --> 01:54:20,800
over the place and go in a lot of

2735
01:54:24,950 --> 01:54:23,199
different directions and you know a very

2736
01:54:27,430 --> 01:54:24,960
small amount

2737
01:54:29,430 --> 01:54:27,440
usually ends up in in a program like

2738
01:54:31,270 --> 01:54:29,440
small percentage right yeah you sit down

2739
01:54:32,629 --> 01:54:31,280
for four hours and you get five minutes

2740
01:54:34,709 --> 01:54:32,639
of screen time that's right that's

2741
01:54:36,790 --> 01:54:34,719
exactly that's typical but with i mean

2742
01:54:39,030 --> 01:54:36,800
one thing we have to acknowledge is that

2743
01:54:39,990 --> 01:54:39,040
yes like there's there is black budget

2744
01:54:41,910 --> 01:54:40,000
tech

2745
01:54:44,709 --> 01:54:41,920
i think we all can recognize that and in

2746
01:54:46,070 --> 01:54:44,719
fact it it's very possibly highly

2747
01:54:47,910 --> 01:54:46,080
advanced

2748
01:54:48,790 --> 01:54:47,920
and i would be the last one to deny that

2749
01:55:00,950 --> 01:54:48,800
i

2750
01:55:03,510 --> 01:55:00,960
that's out there that's got very

2751
01:55:05,589 --> 01:55:03,520
advanced tech so that's totally possible

2752
01:55:07,510 --> 01:55:05,599
but the real question to ask is

2753
01:55:09,350 --> 01:55:07,520
is is that

2754
01:55:11,510 --> 01:55:09,360
if there is a breakaway civilization is

2755
01:55:13,510 --> 01:55:11,520
their mission just to harass the united

2756
01:55:15,510 --> 01:55:13,520
states military or the militaries of the

2757
01:55:17,189 --> 01:55:15,520
world is that what they're doing around

2758
01:55:19,510 --> 01:55:17,199
the world every day

2759
01:55:23,109 --> 01:55:19,520
that i have i have a lot of skepticism

2760
01:55:25,750 --> 01:55:23,119
about that so but but for george knapp

2761
01:55:27,750 --> 01:55:25,760
or um i'm guessing i can't remember but

2762
01:55:29,750 --> 01:55:27,760
probably john greenwald said the same

2763
01:55:31,350 --> 01:55:29,760
similar things yes

2764
01:55:33,669 --> 01:55:31,360
and you know both of them did a very

2765
01:55:36,149 --> 01:55:33,679
good job i i really if they are

2766
01:55:38,790 --> 01:55:36,159
listening i want them both to know

2767
01:55:40,709 --> 01:55:38,800
but yeah i mean there was definitely uh

2768
01:55:42,790 --> 01:55:40,719
this idea that was promoted that a lot

2769
01:55:44,870 --> 01:55:42,800
of these ufos are just black budget tech

2770
01:55:46,950 --> 01:55:44,880
and i i don't know how george really

2771
01:55:49,030 --> 01:55:46,960
thinks about that george

2772
01:55:51,270 --> 01:55:49,040
certainly look this is the guy who broke

2773
01:55:53,589 --> 01:55:51,280
the bob lazar story the guy who

2774
01:55:56,629 --> 01:55:53,599
you know is at s4 and sees

2775
01:55:58,310 --> 01:55:56,639
us working on flying saucers

2776
01:56:00,310 --> 01:55:58,320
and and george has interviewed by his

2777
01:56:01,830 --> 01:56:00,320
own count at least two dozen other

2778
01:56:04,149 --> 01:56:01,840
people who have corroborated various

2779
01:56:07,270 --> 01:56:04,159
parts of bob lazar story you know for an

2780
01:56:10,310 --> 01:56:07,280
area 51 or s4 or wherever so

2781
01:56:13,350 --> 01:56:10,320
he knows full well that there

2782
01:56:14,790 --> 01:56:13,360
is a technology program in nevada and

2783
01:56:16,390 --> 01:56:14,800
probably elsewhere

2784
01:56:18,470 --> 01:56:16,400
where you we've got scientists trying to

2785
01:56:20,310 --> 01:56:18,480
work on this exotic tech

2786
01:56:21,910 --> 01:56:20,320
so i don't think he would deny that and

2787
01:56:24,310 --> 01:56:21,920
i'm sure john

2788
01:56:25,910 --> 01:56:24,320
you know would say the same thing

2789
01:56:29,030 --> 01:56:25,920
to get them on your show and you can ask

2790
01:56:30,790 --> 01:56:29,040
them yourself but uh but the real

2791
01:56:32,709 --> 01:56:30,800
question is

2792
01:56:34,709 --> 01:56:32,719
like why

2793
01:56:36,390 --> 01:56:34,719
would they be happy with their portrayal

2794
01:56:37,990 --> 01:56:36,400
i would actually i'd be curious to know

2795
01:56:39,270 --> 01:56:38,000
if they're happy with their portrayal in

2796
01:56:42,310 --> 01:56:39,280
that episode

2797
01:56:44,390 --> 01:56:42,320
i i i you know if i were interviewed i

2798
01:56:47,189 --> 01:56:44,400
would not be happy i i would not be

2799
01:56:49,109 --> 01:56:47,199
happy either and i mean i

2800
01:56:50,709 --> 01:56:49,119
i just i remember i was just sitting

2801
01:56:53,189 --> 01:56:50,719
back going

2802
01:56:57,270 --> 01:56:53,199
this does does george know what he's

2803
01:56:59,030 --> 01:56:57,280
really saying here the the implications

2804
01:57:02,070 --> 01:56:59,040
of this intention

2805
01:57:03,830 --> 01:57:02,080
i think john greenwald uh

2806
01:57:05,109 --> 01:57:03,840
might have been taken out of context

2807
01:57:07,430 --> 01:57:05,119
because

2808
01:57:08,950 --> 01:57:07,440
uh i don't want to say anything more

2809
01:57:11,990 --> 01:57:08,960
about this i'm just giving my own

2810
01:57:13,589 --> 01:57:12,000
opinion but it seemed like

2811
01:57:15,189 --> 01:57:13,599
they were

2812
01:57:17,270 --> 01:57:15,199
steadfast

2813
01:57:21,910 --> 01:57:17,280
in their opinions

2814
01:57:25,510 --> 01:57:21,920
of of this that the majority of ufos are

2815
01:57:26,709 --> 01:57:25,520
being used as a cover-up intentionally

2816
01:57:27,510 --> 01:57:26,719
over

2817
01:57:29,910 --> 01:57:27,520
uh

2818
01:57:32,149 --> 01:57:29,920
u.s tech and programs that are that are

2819
01:57:36,070 --> 01:57:32,159
going on including

2820
01:57:36,950 --> 01:57:36,080
the tic-tac and that's right and and and

2821
01:57:45,109 --> 01:57:36,960
the

2822
01:57:47,109 --> 01:57:45,119
being used as as a vehicle to help

2823
01:57:48,149 --> 01:57:47,119
support this narrative

2824
01:57:53,350 --> 01:57:48,159
and

2825
01:57:55,350 --> 01:57:53,360
were there were about the staff of ttsa

2826
01:57:56,629 --> 01:57:55,360
and and who was i

2827
01:57:58,470 --> 01:57:56,639
i would almost say that they were

2828
01:58:00,310 --> 01:57:58,480
smeared yeah i would almost say that

2829
01:58:03,270 --> 01:58:00,320
that episode smeared

2830
01:58:05,589 --> 01:58:03,280
put off in valet yes actually yes it

2831
01:58:09,510 --> 01:58:05,599
came really close well when they

2832
01:58:11,589 --> 01:58:09,520
mentioned he mentioned you know uh cia

2833
01:58:14,229 --> 01:58:11,599
operatives that were inside of the ufo

2834
01:58:17,990 --> 01:58:14,239
community the two images they flashed up

2835
01:58:19,430 --> 01:58:18,000
on the screen were put off in valet

2836
01:58:23,589 --> 01:58:19,440
right

2837
01:58:26,790 --> 01:58:23,599
now put off everyone knows had a

2838
01:58:28,629 --> 01:58:26,800
contract with cia that's well known yes

2839
01:58:30,550 --> 01:58:28,639
that contract lasted only two years we

2840
01:58:32,310 --> 01:58:30,560
were talking early 1970s we had a

2841
01:58:34,310 --> 01:58:32,320
stanford research institute and then

2842
01:58:35,669 --> 01:58:34,320
that contract as far as we know

2843
01:58:36,790 --> 01:58:35,679
transferred over to the pentagon or the

2844
01:58:38,950 --> 01:58:36,800
military

2845
01:58:41,189 --> 01:58:38,960
out of cia but yeah i mean and everyone

2846
01:58:42,870 --> 01:58:41,199
knows how puddles had he's had over 50

2847
01:58:45,669 --> 01:58:42,880
years of uh

2848
01:58:48,149 --> 01:58:45,679
sensitive compartmented you know uh

2849
01:58:51,030 --> 01:58:48,159
clearances i mean him and kate green

2850
01:58:52,950 --> 01:58:51,040
both have more than half a century of

2851
01:58:55,589 --> 01:58:52,960
very very uh high level security

2852
01:58:57,430 --> 01:58:55,599
clearances so that's all well known

2853
01:58:58,950 --> 01:58:57,440
uh i i have known hal put off for over

2854
01:59:01,350 --> 01:58:58,960
20 years

2855
01:59:02,709 --> 01:59:01,360
and yes i've i've known the man's

2856
01:59:04,870 --> 01:59:02,719
background

2857
01:59:07,030 --> 01:59:04,880
and i make no bones i've i've liked hal

2858
01:59:08,790 --> 01:59:07,040
for many years and i respect him and i

2859
01:59:12,310 --> 01:59:08,800
don't think he's trying to screw with

2860
01:59:13,510 --> 01:59:12,320
the ufo feel i i've never believed that

2861
01:59:15,270 --> 01:59:13,520
you know if i could turn out to be

2862
01:59:18,070 --> 01:59:15,280
proven wrong one day i i will make a

2863
01:59:19,589 --> 01:59:18,080
mayo cult but i just don't believe it um

2864
01:59:20,950 --> 01:59:19,599
he's always been

2865
01:59:22,390 --> 01:59:20,960
he hasn't told me everything i want to

2866
01:59:24,229 --> 01:59:22,400
know in fact he usually doesn't tell me

2867
01:59:25,510 --> 01:59:24,239
the things i want to know

2868
01:59:26,870 --> 01:59:25,520
but

2869
01:59:28,470 --> 01:59:26,880
conversations i've had with him i've

2870
01:59:30,310 --> 01:59:28,480
found him to be someone of integrity and

2871
01:59:32,470 --> 01:59:30,320
i've never i don't think he's ever i've

2872
01:59:34,950 --> 01:59:32,480
never felt he lied to me

2873
01:59:36,470 --> 01:59:34,960
she's never liked me um we're gonna

2874
01:59:38,470 --> 01:59:36,480
we're gonna take a break right here i'm

2875
01:59:41,189 --> 01:59:38,480
gonna come back um

2876
01:59:42,629 --> 01:59:41,199
and discuss episode four

2877
01:59:43,830 --> 01:59:42,639
um

2878
01:59:45,270 --> 01:59:43,840
do you

2879
01:59:47,669 --> 01:59:45,280
by saying

2880
01:59:49,910 --> 01:59:47,679
that episode three

2881
01:59:52,390 --> 01:59:49,920
was disinformation when it was an

2882
01:59:54,709 --> 01:59:52,400
episode about disinformation

2883
01:59:57,350 --> 01:59:54,719
it's pretty interesting isn't it

2884
01:59:59,350 --> 01:59:57,360
i i i consider that episode to be the

2885
02:00:00,709 --> 01:59:59,360
disinformation there

2886
02:00:02,070 --> 02:00:00,719
you know they're talking about this info

2887
02:00:04,870 --> 02:00:02,080
but i consider that episode to be

2888
02:00:06,310 --> 02:00:04,880
disinfo and and i i i thought

2889
02:00:08,550 --> 02:00:06,320
intentionally or not i don't know i

2890
02:00:09,589 --> 02:00:08,560
thought it was interesting uh that if

2891
02:00:11,189 --> 02:00:09,599
you're going to talk about the

2892
02:00:13,669 --> 02:00:11,199
possibilities of different

2893
02:00:16,310 --> 02:00:13,679
disinformation and how this happens

2894
02:00:19,350 --> 02:00:16,320
then they bring on richard doty uh who i

2895
02:00:20,229 --> 02:00:19,360
spoke to yesterday about this at length

2896
02:00:23,750 --> 02:00:20,239
um

2897
02:00:26,790 --> 02:00:23,760
i mean i called him immediately

2898
02:00:30,470 --> 02:00:26,800
to bring on a guy that was part of the

2899
02:00:33,189 --> 02:00:30,480
air force and osi and disinformation uh

2900
02:00:36,470 --> 02:00:33,199
using members of the ufo community and

2901
02:00:38,629 --> 02:00:36,480
it it like presents that as as evidence

2902
02:00:40,790 --> 02:00:38,639
that this goes on again

2903
02:00:42,070 --> 02:00:40,800
a very interesting choice by jj i know

2904
02:00:43,990 --> 02:00:42,080
you're about to go to break but i just

2905
02:00:47,750 --> 02:00:44,000
got to say this they're saying that the

2906
02:00:49,589 --> 02:00:47,760
u.s government is promoting ufos to hide

2907
02:00:51,990 --> 02:00:49,599
its secret tech yes and again i just

2908
02:00:54,149 --> 02:00:52,000
want to emphasize the act the opposite

2909
02:00:56,550 --> 02:00:54,159
is actually the truth the united states

2910
02:00:58,550 --> 02:00:56,560
government denied denied denied debunked

2911
02:00:59,910 --> 02:00:58,560
debunked debunk ufos for decades and

2912
02:01:01,830 --> 02:00:59,920
decades

2913
02:01:04,470 --> 02:01:01,840
all right they they did the opposite of

2914
02:01:06,390 --> 02:01:04,480
trying to promote ufo belief

2915
02:01:09,109 --> 02:01:06,400
and in fact that continued well into the

2916
02:01:11,669 --> 02:01:09,119
21st century

2917
02:01:13,510 --> 02:01:11,679
up until it continued till 2017 and

2918
02:01:15,350 --> 02:01:13,520
beyond when they started making their

2919
02:01:16,950 --> 02:01:15,360
admissions

2920
02:01:19,030 --> 02:01:16,960
let's take our break right here our

2921
02:01:21,910 --> 02:01:19,040
guest tonight the one and only richard

2922
02:01:24,070 --> 02:01:21,920
bleepin dolan we are doing a full

2923
02:01:27,030 --> 02:01:24,080
analysis and review

2924
02:01:30,310 --> 02:01:27,040
of showtime's new series ufo

2925
02:01:33,830 --> 02:01:30,320
by jj abrams when we come back

2926
02:01:38,870 --> 02:01:36,950
the folklore the mythology and who came

2927
02:01:40,390 --> 02:01:38,880
up next in episode four we'll be right

2928
02:01:46,629 --> 02:01:40,400
back hi everybody this is rob for the

2929
02:01:52,470 --> 02:01:49,109
this is kgra digital broadcasting

2930
02:01:53,830 --> 02:01:52,480
station salt lake city utah van buren

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02:01:55,669 --> 02:01:53,840
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2932
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engine blows up when the body's out of

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02:02:51,669 --> 02:02:48,960
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02:02:57,350 --> 02:02:55,440
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[Music]

2968
02:03:37,350 --> 02:03:34,320
when you're in the house for longer

2969
02:03:39,750 --> 02:03:37,360
periods of time you can see them flying

2970
02:03:41,430 --> 02:03:39,760
or running across the floor

2971
02:03:44,790 --> 02:03:41,440
ooh yuck

2972
02:03:49,030 --> 02:03:44,800
they're unhealthy gross and disgusting

2973
02:03:52,149 --> 02:03:49,040
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2974
02:03:54,229 --> 02:03:52,159
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2988
02:04:33,830 --> 02:04:31,119
gold loves chaos uncertainty and

2989
02:04:35,750 --> 02:04:33,840
disarray history shows us what gold does

2990
02:04:37,510 --> 02:04:35,760
when people aren't sure aren't sure

2991
02:04:40,390 --> 02:04:37,520
about the government the stock market

2992
02:04:43,109 --> 02:04:40,400
their jobs or their retirement savings

2993
02:04:44,950 --> 02:04:43,119
our national debt is skyrocketing gold

2994
02:04:47,189 --> 02:04:44,960
and other precious metals are a defense

2995
02:04:49,910 --> 02:04:47,199
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2996
02:04:52,229 --> 02:04:49,920
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3010
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serious

3013
02:05:47,589 --> 02:05:46,079
i couldn't stay sane without pawn needs

3014
02:05:49,669 --> 02:05:47,599
to brush

3015
02:05:56,149 --> 02:05:49,679
why fade to black

3016
02:06:00,870 --> 02:05:58,310
this is fade to black with jimmy church

3017
02:06:05,430 --> 02:06:00,880
on the game changer radio network and

3018
02:06:21,109 --> 02:06:05,440
kgra the global radio alliance

3019
02:06:22,790 --> 02:06:21,119
[Music]

3020
02:06:26,629 --> 02:06:22,800
welcome back paid to black i am your

3021
02:06:31,430 --> 02:06:28,390
our guest tonight richard dolan who

3022
02:06:32,390 --> 02:06:31,440
during the break is uh playing harmonica

3023
02:06:35,350 --> 02:06:32,400
and

3024
02:06:37,510 --> 02:06:35,360
i had heard over the years that you play

3025
02:06:39,350 --> 02:06:37,520
mean harp

3026
02:06:41,589 --> 02:06:39,360
am i on yes

3027
02:06:44,069 --> 02:06:41,599
okay don't do it

3028
02:06:45,189 --> 02:06:44,079
no no don't don't don't do it we we

3029
02:06:48,709 --> 02:06:45,199
don't need

3030
02:06:49,990 --> 02:06:48,719
um no i enjoy my harmonicas yes

3031
02:06:52,709 --> 02:06:50,000
very much

3032
02:06:55,910 --> 02:06:52,719
you look like you were enjoying it

3033
02:06:57,990 --> 02:06:55,920
now this is this is where now

3034
02:07:00,229 --> 02:06:58,000
i don't want to discourage anybody from

3035
02:07:02,069 --> 02:07:00,239
from watching ufo you need to watch it

3036
02:07:03,750 --> 02:07:02,079
check it out the production value is

3037
02:07:05,830 --> 02:07:03,760
extremely high

3038
02:07:08,229 --> 02:07:05,840
the editing uh

3039
02:07:10,709 --> 02:07:08,239
the framing the cinematography the music

3040
02:07:12,550 --> 02:07:10,719
the soundscape all of that is excellent

3041
02:07:14,229 --> 02:07:12,560
it's excellent and it is very

3042
02:07:18,149 --> 02:07:14,239
thought-provoking

3043
02:07:20,629 --> 02:07:18,159
um and like i said uh episode one

3044
02:07:21,990 --> 02:07:20,639
right there episode two right there

3045
02:07:24,629 --> 02:07:22,000
right there it's cool

3046
02:07:27,910 --> 02:07:24,639
i really enjoyed it episode three rolls

3047
02:07:29,910 --> 02:07:27,920
around and i had a serious wtf moment it

3048
02:07:31,189 --> 02:07:29,920
was like what is actually going on

3049
02:07:34,069 --> 02:07:31,199
what's the message

3050
02:07:37,109 --> 02:07:34,079
then we get to episode four

3051
02:07:38,790 --> 02:07:37,119
and um i don't have uh the professor's

3052
02:07:41,669 --> 02:07:38,800
name in front of me i think he's

3053
02:07:43,990 --> 02:07:41,679
armenian actually from his last name

3054
02:07:45,910 --> 02:07:44,000
and uh which i thought was pretty cool

3055
02:07:48,790 --> 02:07:45,920
and very interesting is the historian

3056
02:07:50,709 --> 02:07:48,800
from penn state yes yes and he

3057
02:07:51,750 --> 02:07:50,719
he then

3058
02:07:55,830 --> 02:07:51,760
uh

3059
02:07:57,430 --> 02:07:55,840
starts to present his case

3060
02:07:58,870 --> 02:07:57,440
about

3061
02:08:00,950 --> 02:07:58,880
um

3062
02:08:01,750 --> 02:08:00,960
people's minds

3063
02:08:04,069 --> 02:08:01,760
and

3064
02:08:07,430 --> 02:08:04,079
the power of suggestion

3065
02:08:10,709 --> 02:08:07,440
um he goes into this in depth but before

3066
02:08:15,030 --> 02:08:10,719
we we start to break this down

3067
02:08:16,629 --> 02:08:15,040
what he suggested from the word go

3068
02:08:17,910 --> 02:08:16,639
is that

3069
02:08:19,990 --> 02:08:17,920
uh

3070
02:08:21,589 --> 02:08:20,000
this is

3071
02:08:24,790 --> 02:08:21,599
imagination

3072
02:08:26,149 --> 02:08:24,800
right and and historically this is

3073
02:08:28,950 --> 02:08:26,159
always right now we're talking about

3074
02:08:31,430 --> 02:08:28,960
abductions uh what they they get to

3075
02:08:34,830 --> 02:08:31,440
abductions yes yes

3076
02:08:38,550 --> 02:08:34,840
um but he was talking about ufos in in

3077
02:08:40,950 --> 02:08:38,560
general um in in society

3078
02:08:45,030 --> 02:08:40,960
and that's and and so when he starts to

3079
02:08:49,109 --> 02:08:45,040
lay this out um i know my reaction

3080
02:08:50,790 --> 02:08:49,119
i mean what was yours like i have to

3081
02:08:54,229 --> 02:08:50,800
what was going through your mind well i

3082
02:08:56,229 --> 02:08:54,239
i would just say uh i reacted to episode

3083
02:08:58,310 --> 02:08:56,239
four and i did watch it

3084
02:08:59,910 --> 02:08:58,320
uh there's two ways that you can react

3085
02:09:01,750 --> 02:08:59,920
one is intellectually in terms of

3086
02:09:02,950 --> 02:09:01,760
content but for me i actually reacted to

3087
02:09:05,510 --> 02:09:02,960
it artistically and i thought

3088
02:09:07,589 --> 02:09:05,520
artistically it sort of fell flat and i

3089
02:09:09,350 --> 02:09:07,599
say that because it didn't have

3090
02:09:12,149 --> 02:09:09,360
you go back 2500 years there was a

3091
02:09:13,270 --> 02:09:12,159
fellow named aristotle he talked about

3092
02:09:14,470 --> 02:09:13,280
unity

3093
02:09:17,189 --> 02:09:14,480
in a production so it didn't have

3094
02:09:19,750 --> 02:09:17,199
aristotelian unity so i actually feel

3095
02:09:20,870 --> 02:09:19,760
that it's bounced all over the place

3096
02:09:22,069 --> 02:09:20,880
and i didn't like that i was like what

3097
02:09:24,790 --> 02:09:22,079
are they actually trying to what's he

3098
02:09:27,030 --> 02:09:24,800
trying to do in this episode and to me

3099
02:09:28,390 --> 02:09:27,040
that was actually never clear so when

3100
02:09:30,149 --> 02:09:28,400
i'm watching

3101
02:09:32,310 --> 02:09:30,159
an episode of anything whether it's a

3102
02:09:34,470 --> 02:09:32,320
movie or a tv show or a documentary i

3103
02:09:36,390 --> 02:09:34,480
want to know like what what's the focus

3104
02:09:37,910 --> 02:09:36,400
here and to me episode four really did

3105
02:09:39,510 --> 02:09:37,920
not have a proper focus it bounced

3106
02:09:40,870 --> 02:09:39,520
around way too much there's a lot of

3107
02:09:42,149 --> 02:09:40,880
abductions but i didn't know where

3108
02:09:43,430 --> 02:09:42,159
they're going

3109
02:09:45,589 --> 02:09:43,440
uh there was

3110
02:09:47,350 --> 02:09:45,599
a lot of psychosocial type of

3111
02:09:48,709 --> 02:09:47,360
explanations of the phenomenon in that

3112
02:09:51,350 --> 02:09:48,719
particular episode such as that

3113
02:09:54,229 --> 02:09:51,360
professor and there was a woman

3114
02:09:55,750 --> 02:09:54,239
and uh what was her name kate dorsch

3115
02:09:58,229 --> 02:09:55,760
was in there and i thought she was the

3116
02:10:00,790 --> 02:09:58,239
one who was most dismissive

3117
02:10:02,069 --> 02:10:00,800
of the subject in my opinion and she

3118
02:10:03,910 --> 02:10:02,079
actually struck me as a bit of a

3119
02:10:05,030 --> 02:10:03,920
totalitarian toward the end she makes

3120
02:10:07,750 --> 02:10:05,040
this statement

3121
02:10:09,830 --> 02:10:07,760
you know it's not good to uh so distrust

3122
02:10:11,109 --> 02:10:09,840
in our major institutions jesus man

3123
02:10:12,390 --> 02:10:11,119
we've been hearing a lot of that lately

3124
02:10:13,510 --> 02:10:12,400
i don't think i want any more of that in

3125
02:10:15,910 --> 02:10:13,520
my face

3126
02:10:17,109 --> 02:10:15,920
i don't think i want people telling me

3127
02:10:19,430 --> 02:10:17,119
oh yeah

3128
02:10:21,669 --> 02:10:19,440
don't and she's actually brought up

3129
02:10:24,229 --> 02:10:21,679
brexit and post trump she's like in this

3130
02:10:26,069 --> 02:10:24,239
age we don't want us so distrust in our

3131
02:10:27,910 --> 02:10:26,079
major institutions i want to punch you

3132
02:10:29,510 --> 02:10:27,920
right in the face after that like who do

3133
02:10:30,709 --> 02:10:29,520
you think you are just shut up go back

3134
02:10:32,790 --> 02:10:30,719
in your hole

3135
02:10:35,589 --> 02:10:32,800
don't tell me that we're not supposed to

3136
02:10:38,790 --> 02:10:35,599
sow distrust in our major institutions

3137
02:10:41,109 --> 02:10:38,800
which have been lying to us for 75 years

3138
02:10:43,510 --> 02:10:41,119
it's like who brought her into the game

3139
02:10:46,709 --> 02:10:43,520
like that was the most useless statement

3140
02:10:48,470 --> 02:10:46,719
of the entire four episodes i found it

3141
02:10:51,030 --> 02:10:48,480
actually offense i don't get offended

3142
02:10:53,430 --> 02:10:51,040
easily i was offended by that

3143
02:10:55,830 --> 02:10:53,440
now um they uh they're looking at

3144
02:10:57,990 --> 02:10:55,840
demonetization youtube canceling

3145
02:11:00,229 --> 02:10:58,000
facebook look we're in full blown

3146
02:11:01,990 --> 02:11:00,239
totalitarian mode here

3147
02:11:04,229 --> 02:11:02,000
all right we don't need anyone else

3148
02:11:07,750 --> 02:11:04,239
egging them on which is what she did

3149
02:11:10,709 --> 02:11:07,760
now uh they bring up the 2k but as they

3150
02:11:11,589 --> 02:11:10,719
started to get into abductions um

3151
02:11:13,510 --> 02:11:11,599
uh

3152
02:11:15,350 --> 02:11:13,520
they bring in you're bringing it back

3153
02:11:18,950 --> 02:11:15,360
here okay good yeah

3154
02:11:21,350 --> 02:11:18,960
no no no well but what they did what i

3155
02:11:23,830 --> 02:11:21,360
okay i'll stay on your point

3156
02:11:25,589 --> 02:11:23,840
they did these cutaways you know to

3157
02:11:28,229 --> 02:11:25,599
president trump

3158
02:11:32,069 --> 02:11:28,239
and and i thought what you know why

3159
02:11:33,589 --> 02:11:32,079
why are you going here

3160
02:11:35,589 --> 02:11:33,599
it's it's

3161
02:11:37,510 --> 02:11:35,599
it's not needed and they didn't talk

3162
02:11:39,430 --> 02:11:37,520
about trump in ufos they didn't talk

3163
02:11:41,270 --> 02:11:39,440
about that they didn't talk about him

3164
02:11:44,629 --> 02:11:41,280
being questioned they didn't talk about

3165
02:11:47,430 --> 02:11:44,639
tucker carlson and and the other uh i

3166
02:11:50,310 --> 02:11:47,440
think it's george stephanopoulos and

3167
02:11:52,709 --> 02:11:50,320
and trump's own son all asked trump

3168
02:11:55,030 --> 02:11:52,719
right they didn't go there they were

3169
02:11:59,030 --> 02:11:55,040
just talking about uh conspiracy

3170
02:12:00,790 --> 02:11:59,040
theories and and mistrust uh uh by yeah

3171
02:12:02,870 --> 02:12:00,800
they use the phrase conspiracy theory a

3172
02:12:05,830 --> 02:12:02,880
few times in that episode yes that's

3173
02:12:07,430 --> 02:12:05,840
always a bad thing yes yes so now now

3174
02:12:08,550 --> 02:12:07,440
they didn't use it ironically that's the

3175
02:12:10,790 --> 02:12:08,560
thing

3176
02:12:13,589 --> 02:12:10,800
they're using it straight up now and

3177
02:12:16,069 --> 02:12:13,599
they bring in travis walton

3178
02:12:17,910 --> 02:12:16,079
um and they bring in betty and barney

3179
02:12:22,069 --> 02:12:17,920
hill

3180
02:12:23,910 --> 02:12:22,079
yes right right and and they they did

3181
02:12:26,709 --> 02:12:23,920
two aspects

3182
02:12:29,109 --> 02:12:26,719
of betty and barney hill and one of them

3183
02:12:30,149 --> 02:12:29,119
and they did this with a card up on the

3184
02:12:32,149 --> 02:12:30,159
screen

3185
02:12:34,470 --> 02:12:32,159
suggesting that betty and barney hill

3186
02:12:36,550 --> 02:12:34,480
faked the entire thing because they were

3187
02:12:37,430 --> 02:12:36,560
an interracial couple

3188
02:12:39,830 --> 02:12:37,440
well

3189
02:12:42,870 --> 02:12:39,840
faked is too strong a word because

3190
02:12:44,069 --> 02:12:42,880
actually no one uh the the implication

3191
02:12:45,669 --> 02:12:44,079
their

3192
02:12:47,589 --> 02:12:45,679
hypnotherapist for that was a guy named

3193
02:12:50,310 --> 02:12:47,599
benjamin simon yes

3194
02:12:52,149 --> 02:12:50,320
back in the 60s and he actually he was a

3195
02:12:53,589 --> 02:12:52,159
big shot psychotherapist worked for the

3196
02:12:55,750 --> 02:12:53,599
us army

3197
02:12:58,390 --> 02:12:55,760
he was he was a major of course he had

3198
02:13:00,629 --> 02:12:58,400
no experience with ufo abductions who

3199
02:13:02,870 --> 02:13:00,639
did no one did so he this was a new

3200
02:13:04,709 --> 02:13:02,880
thing for him and yes his

3201
02:13:06,629 --> 02:13:04,719
theory at least i don't know if he had

3202
02:13:07,990 --> 02:13:06,639
it the whole time but

3203
02:13:09,750 --> 02:13:08,000
i mean they were an interracial couple

3204
02:13:11,109 --> 02:13:09,760
in the early 60s that is a stressful

3205
02:13:14,229 --> 02:13:11,119
thing so

3206
02:13:16,709 --> 02:13:14,239
or easily could have been probably was

3207
02:13:18,310 --> 02:13:16,719
and so you know his theory was that

3208
02:13:20,149 --> 02:13:18,320
somehow that stress

3209
02:13:21,589 --> 02:13:20,159
related to their story but he actually

3210
02:13:23,510 --> 02:13:21,599
also stated he believed that they were

3211
02:13:25,830 --> 02:13:23,520
truthful which came out when they made

3212
02:13:27,830 --> 02:13:25,840
it up which came out later

3213
02:13:28,950 --> 02:13:27,840
um and uh

3214
02:13:32,149 --> 02:13:28,960
they

3215
02:13:34,629 --> 02:13:32,159
the uh the travis walton aspect was uh

3216
02:13:36,229 --> 02:13:34,639
brought up that case and then they bring

3217
02:13:39,510 --> 02:13:36,239
in calvin parker

3218
02:13:44,390 --> 02:13:39,520
and and pascagoula yes right now

3219
02:13:46,950 --> 02:13:44,400
and the the overall bent the flavor

3220
02:13:48,550 --> 02:13:46,960
that i felt was being presented in these

3221
02:13:49,350 --> 02:13:48,560
three cases

3222
02:13:51,830 --> 02:13:49,360
that

3223
02:13:54,390 --> 02:13:51,840
the abduction phenomena in general and

3224
02:13:55,270 --> 02:13:54,400
they interjected other

3225
02:13:57,109 --> 02:13:55,280
uh

3226
02:13:59,030 --> 02:13:57,119
abductees and some of their statements

3227
02:14:00,790 --> 02:13:59,040
that they had made that this was all

3228
02:14:03,030 --> 02:14:00,800
crazy talk

3229
02:14:05,830 --> 02:14:03,040
and and i sort of they were they were

3230
02:14:07,830 --> 02:14:05,840
sympathetic though to the people like

3231
02:14:09,589 --> 02:14:07,840
the the actual statements about betty

3232
02:14:11,910 --> 02:14:09,599
and barney hill or i don't remember if

3233
02:14:13,189 --> 02:14:11,920
they really discussed travis walton very

3234
02:14:15,830 --> 02:14:13,199
much

3235
02:14:18,310 --> 02:14:15,840
but i mean there was no overt insult i

3236
02:14:20,069 --> 02:14:18,320
mean like no one was demeaning the hills

3237
02:14:21,189 --> 02:14:20,079
right i mean no one was

3238
02:14:23,030 --> 02:14:21,199
saying

3239
02:14:24,870 --> 02:14:23,040
overtly bad things about them the

3240
02:14:27,750 --> 02:14:24,880
impression you get it's a different form

3241
02:14:30,629 --> 02:14:27,760
of debunkery so it's it's a nice

3242
02:14:31,910 --> 02:14:30,639
debunkery it's polite it's respectful

3243
02:14:34,229 --> 02:14:31,920
debunkery

3244
02:14:36,870 --> 02:14:34,239
well and and the way that it was

3245
02:14:39,350 --> 02:14:36,880
and the way that uh the historian from

3246
02:14:42,149 --> 02:14:39,360
penn state his name escapes me

3247
02:14:43,910 --> 02:14:42,159
said that you can look at this in in

3248
02:14:47,510 --> 02:14:43,920
time capsules for

3249
02:14:49,510 --> 02:14:47,520
different parts of modern history

3250
02:14:52,149 --> 02:14:49,520
where at one point abductions were

3251
02:14:53,830 --> 02:14:52,159
happening happening outside of your home

3252
02:14:56,229 --> 02:14:53,840
and then at the next point it was

3253
02:14:58,950 --> 02:14:56,239
happening in remote areas

3254
02:15:01,510 --> 02:14:58,960
uh then they bring up pascagoula and and

3255
02:15:04,629 --> 02:15:01,520
calvin parker and then he goes and then

3256
02:15:07,430 --> 02:15:04,639
suddenly in the 1980s abduction is

3257
02:15:10,390 --> 02:15:07,440
happening in our bedrooms and we have to

3258
02:15:12,709 --> 02:15:10,400
look at why and what it was going on

3259
02:15:14,550 --> 02:15:12,719
except he's kind of wrong but but this

3260
02:15:16,310 --> 02:15:14,560
is the way remember

3261
02:15:19,750 --> 02:15:16,320
exactly what he said that's exactly what

3262
02:15:22,069 --> 02:15:19,760
he said and they they they they go to a

3263
02:15:24,229 --> 02:15:22,079
clip of an abductee

3264
02:15:27,750 --> 02:15:24,239
um very briefly

3265
02:15:31,109 --> 02:15:27,760
when she says and they selected this for

3266
02:15:35,270 --> 02:15:31,119
for a reason because she sounds crazy

3267
02:15:37,430 --> 02:15:35,280
and if you're seeing this um as a viewer

3268
02:15:39,109 --> 02:15:37,440
and you you get this overall context of

3269
02:15:41,510 --> 02:15:39,119
the way that this is being presented

3270
02:15:43,990 --> 02:15:41,520
richard she says yeah well they come to

3271
02:15:45,910 --> 02:15:44,000
me in my bedroom and and every time they

3272
02:15:48,950 --> 02:15:45,920
are here they're only

3273
02:15:51,589 --> 02:15:48,960
behind me when my back is turned right

3274
02:15:53,910 --> 02:15:51,599
no matter what and it was like this

3275
02:15:56,310 --> 02:15:53,920
nothing to do with anything but they

3276
02:15:58,390 --> 02:15:56,320
presented that way because well you know

3277
02:16:00,709 --> 02:15:58,400
what abductions are crazy talk and this

3278
02:16:04,310 --> 02:16:00,719
is why

3279
02:16:05,350 --> 02:16:04,320
yeah yeah but i mean to bring up the uh

3280
02:16:07,109 --> 02:16:05,360
gosh i wish i could remember that

3281
02:16:08,950 --> 02:16:07,119
historian's name too there is there's

3282
02:16:11,350 --> 02:16:08,960
look there's a value in looking at the

3283
02:16:13,830 --> 02:16:11,360
psychosocial element of this and

3284
02:16:17,350 --> 02:16:13,840
including abductions there are there is

3285
02:16:19,589 --> 02:16:17,360
an evolution in how these beings are

3286
02:16:21,109 --> 02:16:19,599
reported i mean i've wondered about this

3287
02:16:22,069 --> 02:16:21,119
many times myself

3288
02:16:23,910 --> 02:16:22,079
uh

3289
02:16:25,750 --> 02:16:23,920
in the 1940s and 50s there was there

3290
02:16:28,229 --> 02:16:25,760
were claims of sightings of beings

3291
02:16:31,109 --> 02:16:28,239
particularly starting in 1954 in europe

3292
02:16:34,709 --> 02:16:31,119
and in south america they were short

3293
02:16:36,830 --> 02:16:34,719
but they weren't classic grays

3294
02:16:38,870 --> 02:16:36,840
now you do you get a kind of an

3295
02:16:40,309 --> 02:16:38,880
evolutionary like an evolution of

3296
02:16:42,309 --> 02:16:40,319
description

3297
02:16:44,389 --> 02:16:42,319
through the 60s that leads to the

3298
02:16:46,870 --> 02:16:44,399
classic grays

3299
02:16:50,469 --> 02:16:46,880
and that's a bit troubling like so it's

3300
02:16:52,150 --> 02:16:50,479
very easy to ask yourself

3301
02:16:53,750 --> 02:16:52,160
are people

3302
02:16:55,750 --> 02:16:53,760
seeing

3303
02:17:00,070 --> 02:16:55,760
their

3304
02:17:02,070 --> 02:17:00,080
think an alien's supposed to look like i

3305
02:17:04,950 --> 02:17:02,080
mean it's it's very

3306
02:17:06,790 --> 02:17:04,960
it's impossible to ignore asking that

3307
02:17:07,669 --> 02:17:06,800
when you look at

3308
02:17:10,709 --> 02:17:07,679
the

3309
02:17:12,230 --> 02:17:10,719
70-plus year history of sightings of of

3310
02:17:13,349 --> 02:17:12,240
alien beings which back in the day were

3311
02:17:15,030 --> 02:17:13,359
called humanoids they weren't even

3312
02:17:17,190 --> 02:17:15,040
called aliens

3313
02:17:19,030 --> 02:17:17,200
there is a bit of an evolution

3314
02:17:22,709 --> 02:17:19,040
having said that

3315
02:17:24,870 --> 02:17:22,719
there also are consistencies

3316
02:17:28,309 --> 02:17:24,880
but there's a lot of variety

3317
02:17:30,790 --> 02:17:28,319
and so some of that variety like it's

3318
02:17:32,950 --> 02:17:30,800
you absolutely have to ask

3319
02:17:34,790 --> 02:17:32,960
are there cultural dimensions to this

3320
02:17:36,150 --> 02:17:34,800
phenomenon

3321
02:17:37,669 --> 02:17:36,160
um

3322
02:17:39,429 --> 02:17:37,679
i mean it just has to be has to be

3323
02:17:40,629 --> 02:17:39,439
explored and i have tried to explore it

3324
02:17:43,750 --> 02:17:40,639
on my own and sometimes i've written

3325
02:17:45,589 --> 02:17:43,760
about it too and

3326
02:17:48,230 --> 02:17:45,599
the thing is i do believe that there are

3327
02:17:49,910 --> 02:17:48,240
cultural dimensions but that they're not

3328
02:17:51,190 --> 02:17:49,920
they're not the dominant

3329
02:17:52,070 --> 02:17:51,200
element

3330
02:17:53,509 --> 02:17:52,080
like

3331
02:17:55,270 --> 02:17:53,519
these beings

3332
02:17:56,950 --> 02:17:55,280
i personally am convinced have the

3333
02:17:58,629 --> 02:17:56,960
ability to screw with our cognitive

3334
02:18:00,150 --> 02:17:58,639
abilities and they have the ability to

3335
02:18:01,110 --> 02:18:00,160
manage our memory and to screw with our

3336
02:18:03,750 --> 02:18:01,120
memory

3337
02:18:05,429 --> 02:18:03,760
so we're not we're not at our best

3338
02:18:07,910 --> 02:18:05,439
when we encounter them

3339
02:18:10,389 --> 02:18:07,920
they know how to deal with us

3340
02:18:11,830 --> 02:18:10,399
and we shouldn't be surprised our own

3341
02:18:13,110 --> 02:18:11,840
intelligence and military communities

3342
02:18:14,709 --> 02:18:13,120
they know how to screw with your mind

3343
02:18:16,870 --> 02:18:14,719
too they've been working on this for

3344
02:18:18,070 --> 02:18:16,880
ages so

3345
02:18:20,950 --> 02:18:18,080
if there's

3346
02:18:22,549 --> 02:18:20,960
another advanced group that's here

3347
02:18:24,629 --> 02:18:22,559
they could do some kind of memory

3348
02:18:26,469 --> 02:18:24,639
fogging and maybe you would interpret it

3349
02:18:27,270 --> 02:18:26,479
as a being that's got antennas on his

3350
02:18:29,190 --> 02:18:27,280
head

3351
02:18:31,429 --> 02:18:29,200
which people sometimes saw that back in

3352
02:18:34,950 --> 02:18:31,439
the 50s antennas like you know my

3353
02:18:37,750 --> 02:18:34,960
favorite martian i was an old tv show

3354
02:18:39,349 --> 02:18:37,760
so there's a value i'm just saying i'm

3355
02:18:41,830 --> 02:18:39,359
defending this man to some extent here

3356
02:18:43,990 --> 02:18:41,840
there's a value in asking

3357
02:18:45,830 --> 02:18:44,000
to what extent are cultural determinants

3358
02:18:49,030 --> 02:18:45,840
involved here and how we perceive this

3359
02:18:51,030 --> 02:18:49,040
phenomenon i think it has to be asked

3360
02:18:53,190 --> 02:18:51,040
and americans aren't are generally

3361
02:18:54,629 --> 02:18:53,200
disinclined to go there europeans are

3362
02:18:56,629 --> 02:18:54,639
much more interested especially the

3363
02:18:58,389 --> 02:18:56,639
brits they have a long history of this

3364
02:19:01,030 --> 02:18:58,399
school of thought

3365
02:19:01,990 --> 02:19:01,040
so um but having said that i do not

3366
02:19:04,230 --> 02:19:02,000
believe i don't want anyone to

3367
02:19:05,349 --> 02:19:04,240
misunderstand me i don't believe

3368
02:19:07,190 --> 02:19:05,359
that that's

3369
02:19:08,950 --> 02:19:07,200
the full and final explanation of what

3370
02:19:12,309 --> 02:19:08,960
people are dealing with benny and barney

3371
02:19:16,389 --> 02:19:12,319
hill my opinion strong opinion here they

3372
02:19:18,230 --> 02:19:16,399
were they were abducted they were taken

3373
02:19:20,790 --> 02:19:18,240
and

3374
02:19:23,669 --> 02:19:20,800
travis walton that man was taken he's

3375
02:19:25,990 --> 02:19:23,679
with a bunch of other guys they all took

3376
02:19:28,790 --> 02:19:26,000
polly's by the way polygraph did you see

3377
02:19:31,750 --> 02:19:28,800
a ufo yes did you see travis walden get

3378
02:19:33,429 --> 02:19:31,760
hit by a bloomberg yes uh you know

3379
02:19:35,990 --> 02:19:33,439
they all passed

3380
02:19:36,870 --> 02:19:36,000
they're not they're not lying about this

3381
02:19:39,030 --> 02:19:36,880
so

3382
02:19:41,270 --> 02:19:39,040
there are abduction cases i think that

3383
02:19:43,990 --> 02:19:41,280
are just too strong to dismiss and

3384
02:19:45,830 --> 02:19:44,000
this this episode did not provide any of

3385
02:19:47,429 --> 02:19:45,840
that evidence at all not at all they

3386
02:19:50,630 --> 02:19:47,439
made it look like it was fantasy yeah

3387
02:19:52,950 --> 02:19:50,640
they made it look like it was fantasy so

3388
02:19:55,110 --> 02:19:52,960
if we go

3389
02:19:58,950 --> 02:19:55,120
back and we look at an overall

3390
02:20:00,830 --> 02:19:58,960
assessment of this four power four part

3391
02:20:02,550 --> 02:20:00,840
high dollar

3392
02:20:03,990 --> 02:20:02,560
uh

3393
02:20:06,150 --> 02:20:04,000
big time

3394
02:20:08,790 --> 02:20:06,160
hollywood production this is four

3395
02:20:11,270 --> 02:20:08,800
episodes from jj abrams who's

3396
02:20:13,030 --> 02:20:11,280
uh you know great movies over the years

3397
02:20:14,710 --> 02:20:13,040
there's no question about it but he's

3398
02:20:17,670 --> 02:20:14,720
definitely putting his reputation on the

3399
02:20:20,309 --> 02:20:17,680
line so if we and ask is this this

3400
02:20:22,950 --> 02:20:20,319
information too this episode so

3401
02:20:24,870 --> 02:20:22,960
i'm going to say maybe it is so

3402
02:20:27,349 --> 02:20:24,880
how do we uh

3403
02:20:31,110 --> 02:20:27,359
uh how do we start to

3404
02:20:33,750 --> 02:20:31,120
uh give an overall assessment of this

3405
02:20:35,750 --> 02:20:33,760
presentation you know from episode one

3406
02:20:38,630 --> 02:20:35,760
to episode four

3407
02:20:42,550 --> 02:20:38,640
um if you were going to give it a rating

3408
02:20:47,670 --> 02:20:45,429
well uh we mentioned that the

3409
02:20:49,110 --> 02:20:47,680
peter jennings ufo scene is believing i

3410
02:20:50,870 --> 02:20:49,120
think this follows a very similar

3411
02:20:53,190 --> 02:20:50,880
pattern to that

3412
02:20:56,630 --> 02:20:53,200
and in fact it it follows the pattern to

3413
02:20:58,389 --> 02:20:56,640
that the classic 1966 walter cronkite uh

3414
02:21:00,230 --> 02:20:58,399
thing on ufos that was sponsored by the

3415
02:21:01,590 --> 02:21:00,240
cia and the robertson panel

3416
02:21:03,670 --> 02:21:01,600
recommendations

3417
02:21:05,030 --> 02:21:03,680
which a young carl sagan appeared on in

3418
02:21:06,630 --> 02:21:05,040
fact that was featured in one of the

3419
02:21:08,389 --> 02:21:06,640
episodes that

3420
02:21:10,230 --> 02:21:08,399
shot of cronkite

3421
02:21:14,309 --> 02:21:10,240
i can't remember which episode maybe the

3422
02:21:16,630 --> 02:21:14,319
first one that was explicit intelligence

3423
02:21:18,469 --> 02:21:16,640
community disinformation back in 1966

3424
02:21:20,710 --> 02:21:18,479
was it ufo's fact or fantasy i think it

3425
02:21:24,550 --> 02:21:20,720
was called

3426
02:21:25,750 --> 02:21:24,560
and this this series by abrams

3427
02:21:27,670 --> 02:21:25,760
i'm really going to be thinking about

3428
02:21:29,349 --> 02:21:27,680
this because you know i've only just

3429
02:21:31,830 --> 02:21:29,359
seen it and i only scrubbed through

3430
02:21:34,790 --> 02:21:31,840
episode two i that was the one that i i

3431
02:21:35,750 --> 02:21:34,800
skimmed i watched the other three

3432
02:21:37,990 --> 02:21:35,760
um

3433
02:21:39,510 --> 02:21:38,000
but it follows a pattern that the other

3434
02:21:40,870 --> 02:21:39,520
the other two documentaries i mentioned

3435
02:21:41,910 --> 02:21:40,880
follow which is that you inflate the

3436
02:21:43,349 --> 02:21:41,920
balloon in the first half and you

3437
02:21:45,910 --> 02:21:43,359
deflate that damn thing in the second

3438
02:21:49,110 --> 02:21:45,920
half so it's like you build up

3439
02:21:50,950 --> 02:21:49,120
this sense of a real interesting problem

3440
02:21:52,790 --> 02:21:50,960
phenomenon

3441
02:21:54,950 --> 02:21:52,800
and then you spend the whole second half

3442
02:21:56,950 --> 02:21:54,960
of whatever you're doing

3443
02:21:59,349 --> 02:21:56,960
pulling taking the air out of it which

3444
02:22:01,190 --> 02:21:59,359
really does seem like what he did

3445
02:22:03,510 --> 02:22:01,200
and and to me

3446
02:22:05,910 --> 02:22:03,520
think about it what he's saying is

3447
02:22:08,309 --> 02:22:05,920
there's a real ufo phenomenon but it's

3448
02:22:09,990 --> 02:22:08,319
not aliens and there are no abductions

3449
02:22:10,870 --> 02:22:10,000
that's essentially the message you're

3450
02:22:14,150 --> 02:22:10,880
getting

3451
02:22:16,309 --> 02:22:14,160
that that we've got advanced tech

3452
02:22:18,389 --> 02:22:16,319
that seems to be the message and he's to

3453
02:22:21,349 --> 02:22:18,399
me that's a message that if that's the

3454
02:22:25,270 --> 02:22:21,359
message that is disinformation now

3455
02:22:27,910 --> 02:22:25,280
and if by using diana pasulka and leslie

3456
02:22:30,630 --> 02:22:27,920
kane and george knapp

3457
02:22:32,070 --> 02:22:30,640
uh so prominently through this including

3458
02:22:33,110 --> 02:22:32,080
kevin day

3459
02:22:35,590 --> 02:22:33,120
uh

3460
02:22:37,349 --> 02:22:35,600
who said he came across very well yeah

3461
02:22:38,469 --> 02:22:37,359
yeah kevin day

3462
02:22:39,349 --> 02:22:38,479
very well

3463
02:22:43,349 --> 02:22:39,359
uh

3464
02:22:46,230 --> 02:22:43,359
you know almost you know kevin day it

3465
02:22:47,670 --> 02:22:46,240
comes across you know little melancholy

3466
02:22:50,389 --> 02:22:47,680
about this

3467
02:22:52,230 --> 02:22:50,399
you know i think that he was thrust into

3468
02:22:53,349 --> 02:22:52,240
something that he wasn't comfortable

3469
02:22:56,790 --> 02:22:53,359
with

3470
02:22:58,070 --> 02:22:56,800
um the spotlight is on him and he's got

3471
02:22:58,870 --> 02:22:58,080
questions

3472
02:23:01,030 --> 02:22:58,880
and

3473
02:23:02,389 --> 02:23:01,040
he i think that his own government has

3474
02:23:03,190 --> 02:23:02,399
failed him

3475
02:23:07,510 --> 02:23:03,200
and

3476
02:23:09,270 --> 02:23:07,520
point i lost everything

3477
02:23:11,429 --> 02:23:09,280
you know kevin is a hell of a guy and

3478
02:23:12,469 --> 02:23:11,439
he's a great guy and he's a decent human

3479
02:23:15,030 --> 02:23:12,479
being

3480
02:23:16,950 --> 02:23:15,040
honest as the day is long and he's

3481
02:23:18,630 --> 02:23:16,960
you know and he he was operating radar

3482
02:23:21,429 --> 02:23:18,640
he was the chief radar guy and on the

3483
02:23:23,270 --> 02:23:21,439
princeton and tracking these these ufos

3484
02:23:26,230 --> 02:23:23,280
the tic tac ufos

3485
02:23:27,670 --> 02:23:26,240
um he's a absolutely superb human being

3486
02:23:30,070 --> 02:23:27,680
yeah i think he seems like he's had a

3487
02:23:33,190 --> 02:23:30,080
rough time you know now um oh ralph

3488
02:23:35,510 --> 02:23:33,200
blumenthal uh also we can't let uh let

3489
02:23:36,950 --> 02:23:35,520
him escape us um and the way that he was

3490
02:23:39,349 --> 02:23:36,960
featured now

3491
02:23:41,190 --> 02:23:39,359
if this he also came across very well i

3492
02:23:43,750 --> 02:23:41,200
thought he's great yeah he's great

3493
02:23:45,670 --> 02:23:43,760
absolutely um but

3494
02:23:47,590 --> 02:23:45,680
are they all

3495
02:23:49,030 --> 02:23:47,600
i don't want to say

3496
02:23:50,070 --> 02:23:49,040
tools

3497
02:23:52,950 --> 02:23:50,080
but they

3498
02:23:55,750 --> 02:23:52,960
it's even suggested in in this

3499
02:23:58,150 --> 02:23:55,760
documentary uh that tom delong was the

3500
02:24:00,870 --> 02:23:58,160
useful idiot and i believe that was the

3501
02:24:03,110 --> 02:24:00,880
words that were used carrion used that

3502
02:24:05,429 --> 02:24:03,120
word yeah carrion and so

3503
02:24:06,630 --> 02:24:05,439
um is history going to look back at this

3504
02:24:07,830 --> 02:24:06,640
series

3505
02:24:09,349 --> 02:24:07,840
um

3506
02:24:11,750 --> 02:24:09,359
you know as

3507
02:24:15,830 --> 02:24:11,760
as bending the truth somewhat

3508
02:24:18,710 --> 02:24:15,840
and using uh some of these very

3509
02:24:21,830 --> 02:24:18,720
credible uh uh people

3510
02:24:23,910 --> 02:24:21,840
in this to support this this is this

3511
02:24:26,389 --> 02:24:23,920
this information i'm gonna just say this

3512
02:24:28,550 --> 02:24:26,399
straight out because that i'm feeling a

3513
02:24:31,110 --> 02:24:28,560
little uncomfortable after watching all

3514
02:24:32,950 --> 02:24:31,120
four episodes

3515
02:24:35,910 --> 02:24:32,960
yeah i agree

3516
02:24:38,070 --> 02:24:35,920
i i agree with that

3517
02:24:39,510 --> 02:24:38,080
yeah the last two episodes actually were

3518
02:24:41,349 --> 02:24:39,520
were

3519
02:24:42,550 --> 02:24:41,359
unsatisfying

3520
02:24:48,550 --> 02:24:42,560
and

3521
02:24:49,429 --> 02:24:48,560
very sophisticated forms of debunkery

3522
02:24:57,429 --> 02:24:49,439
in

3523
02:25:00,230 --> 02:24:57,439
school and and james carrion uh if

3524
02:25:02,630 --> 02:25:00,240
there's one quote from this uh

3525
02:25:04,550 --> 02:25:02,640
that will continue on

3526
02:25:07,750 --> 02:25:04,560
is he goes look

3527
02:25:09,429 --> 02:25:07,760
um i i'm not a i'm not a skeptic and i'm

3528
02:25:11,429 --> 02:25:09,439
not a debunker

3529
02:25:12,550 --> 02:25:11,439
right jake's carried

3530
02:25:13,990 --> 02:25:12,560
says that

3531
02:25:17,510 --> 02:25:14,000
straight into the camera said he was a

3532
02:25:18,950 --> 02:25:17,520
truth seeker yes he's a truth seeker yes

3533
02:25:20,870 --> 02:25:18,960
and uh

3534
02:25:23,190 --> 02:25:20,880
maybe he is i mean look i'm going to

3535
02:25:25,190 --> 02:25:23,200
give him the benefit of the doubt i

3536
02:25:26,710 --> 02:25:25,200
who who am i to call someone out as as

3537
02:25:28,469 --> 02:25:26,720
being dishonest like i'm not i'm not

3538
02:25:31,190 --> 02:25:28,479
going to do that and i don't know he

3539
02:25:32,790 --> 02:25:31,200
could be very sincere in fact i think

3540
02:25:34,150 --> 02:25:32,800
i've never had reason to think that he

3541
02:25:36,150 --> 02:25:34,160
believes anything other than what he has

3542
02:25:39,110 --> 02:25:36,160
said honestly i'm not saying anything

3543
02:25:43,590 --> 02:25:40,790
by his way of looking at it he is a

3544
02:25:47,270 --> 02:25:43,600
truth seeker right and um and the

3545
02:25:48,950 --> 02:25:47,280
historical perspective about james

3546
02:25:53,510 --> 02:25:48,960
is he was there

3547
02:25:57,910 --> 02:25:53,520
he was there 2006 bigelow 2007 2008 he

3548
02:26:00,630 --> 02:25:57,920
leaves mufon in 2009. who uh uh clift

3549
02:26:01,990 --> 02:26:00,640
clifton uh cliff uh clifford clift yeah

3550
02:26:06,630 --> 02:26:02,000
clifford cliff

3551
02:26:07,990 --> 02:26:06,640
uh uh came in temporarily and uh and a

3552
02:26:09,830 --> 02:26:08,000
story about that that's relevant to this

3553
02:26:11,270 --> 02:26:09,840
conversation yeah go ahead

3554
02:26:12,309 --> 02:26:11,280
when clifford came on as the new

3555
02:26:15,349 --> 02:26:12,319
director

3556
02:26:16,790 --> 02:26:15,359
uh i met him shortly after that and he

3557
02:26:19,429 --> 02:26:16,800
asked me he took me aside i wasn't a

3558
02:26:20,550 --> 02:26:19,439
mufon member but he said hey i'm new

3559
02:26:23,190 --> 02:26:20,560
here and i would just like to know if

3560
02:26:24,870 --> 02:26:23,200
you have any uh if you have any advice

3561
02:26:26,309 --> 02:26:24,880
and i said yes i would like you to clear

3562
02:26:27,990 --> 02:26:26,319
every intelligence operative out of

3563
02:26:29,670 --> 02:26:28,000
mufon that you can

3564
02:26:31,750 --> 02:26:29,680
get him the hell out that's what i said

3565
02:26:33,190 --> 02:26:31,760
to him and he gave me this

3566
02:26:36,389 --> 02:26:33,200
this look

3567
02:26:38,790 --> 02:26:36,399
like what the hell i can't do

3568
02:26:41,429 --> 02:26:38,800
like he just seemed overwhelmed by what

3569
02:26:46,469 --> 02:26:41,439
i said but i absolutely said that to him

3570
02:26:49,830 --> 02:26:48,790
i've had i've had uh some communication

3571
02:26:53,429 --> 02:26:49,840
with him

3572
02:26:55,110 --> 02:26:53,439
uh over the years genuine guy cool guy

3573
02:26:57,590 --> 02:26:55,120
cool guy yeah i pissed him off wicked

3574
02:27:01,030 --> 02:26:57,600
good actually at the 2011 mufon

3575
02:27:02,950 --> 02:27:01,040
conference absolutely got him so mad

3576
02:27:05,750 --> 02:27:02,960
um i'll just tell this it's just a fun

3577
02:27:07,510 --> 02:27:05,760
story um the hell was i doing oh yeah so

3578
02:27:08,950 --> 02:27:07,520
i was i was there to do a secret space

3579
02:27:11,270 --> 02:27:08,960
lecture i think it was like my first

3580
02:27:13,429 --> 02:27:11,280
major secret space type lecture

3581
02:27:15,110 --> 02:27:13,439
and uh i cut it short 15 minutes and i

3582
02:27:17,270 --> 02:27:15,120
spent the last 15 minutes because at

3583
02:27:19,190 --> 02:27:17,280
that time mufon was in the midst of a

3584
02:27:23,590 --> 02:27:19,200
mutiny

3585
02:27:25,990 --> 02:27:23,600
um they were claimed chase kletzke um

3586
02:27:28,710 --> 02:27:26,000
elaine douglas delayed elaine douglas

3587
02:27:30,550 --> 02:27:28,720
may she rest in peace uh and james

3588
02:27:33,190 --> 02:27:30,560
clarkson actually had all gone on jerry

3589
02:27:35,750 --> 02:27:33,200
pippen show at that time talking about

3590
02:27:38,070 --> 02:27:35,760
how mufon was hiding data from its

3591
02:27:39,590 --> 02:27:38,080
members and like there was a big thing

3592
02:27:41,110 --> 02:27:39,600
um

3593
02:27:45,590 --> 02:27:41,120
and

3594
02:27:47,910 --> 02:27:45,600
got booted out of the mufon conference

3595
02:27:48,950 --> 02:27:47,920
that year so anyway i'm there

3596
02:27:51,270 --> 02:27:48,960
and i

3597
02:27:53,349 --> 02:27:51,280
said i'm spending the last 15 minutes

3598
02:27:55,590 --> 02:27:53,359
and i'm going to talk about how mufon

3599
02:27:57,670 --> 02:27:55,600
needs to reform

3600
02:27:59,270 --> 02:27:57,680
and

3601
02:28:00,550 --> 02:27:59,280
uh at the end of it i was taken out of

3602
02:28:02,150 --> 02:28:00,560
the woodshed in the back room and

3603
02:28:04,070 --> 02:28:02,160
clifford was there and i heard that

3604
02:28:06,550 --> 02:28:04,080
clifford two people said to me clifford

3605
02:28:08,710 --> 02:28:06,560
like turned purple and he said dolan

3606
02:28:10,790 --> 02:28:08,720
is never speaking at another effing

3607
02:28:13,110 --> 02:28:10,800
conference here ever again and he didn't

3608
02:28:15,590 --> 02:28:13,120
say effing so um

3609
02:28:17,190 --> 02:28:15,600
and and i didn't speak at mufan for the

3610
02:28:19,830 --> 02:28:17,200
next uh

3611
02:28:22,309 --> 02:28:19,840
uh quite a few years yeah well uh okay

3612
02:28:24,790 --> 02:28:22,319
another side note to history

3613
02:28:26,550 --> 02:28:24,800
so i call up richard i'm speaking at

3614
02:28:29,510 --> 02:28:26,560
mufon i'm doing the keynote on like

3615
02:28:31,030 --> 02:28:29,520
friday night and uh i call up richard

3616
02:28:32,230 --> 02:28:31,040
and i said hey man

3617
02:28:34,150 --> 02:28:32,240
uh

3618
02:28:36,230 --> 02:28:34,160
you want to do mufon with me and just

3619
02:28:38,830 --> 02:28:36,240
come up on on stage and

3620
02:28:41,510 --> 02:28:38,840
you go jimmy

3621
02:28:43,670 --> 02:28:41,520
uh i don't remember this this was

3622
02:28:45,590 --> 02:28:43,680
everything yeah yeah yeah i was doing

3623
02:28:48,309 --> 02:28:45,600
the hanger one thing

3624
02:28:49,990 --> 02:28:48,319
and uh we were bringing out the cast and

3625
02:28:52,150 --> 02:28:50,000
you were like you know what not this

3626
02:28:54,309 --> 02:28:52,160
year man i just don't think it's the

3627
02:28:56,389 --> 02:28:54,319
right thing to do well you know it's

3628
02:28:58,550 --> 02:28:56,399
just like i got tired i got really down

3629
02:29:00,710 --> 02:28:58,560
on move on after a while and just

3630
02:29:01,910 --> 02:29:00,720
i mean honestly it was just more work

3631
02:29:03,190 --> 02:29:01,920
than it was worth i could do a lot of

3632
02:29:05,030 --> 02:29:03,200
the conferences there's good people

3633
02:29:07,110 --> 02:29:05,040
there great people actually

3634
02:29:08,389 --> 02:29:07,120
but uh it just it wasn't worth i was too

3635
02:29:09,590 --> 02:29:08,399
busy anyway

3636
02:29:11,429 --> 02:29:09,600
so they're going to blackball me

3637
02:29:13,910 --> 02:29:11,439
unofficially for a few years and i touch

3638
02:29:15,830 --> 02:29:13,920
themselves that invites you back and

3639
02:29:17,429 --> 02:29:15,840
and and i thought i could talk you into

3640
02:29:19,670 --> 02:29:17,439
it but uh

3641
02:29:21,110 --> 02:29:19,680
i ended up going solo thanks richard

3642
02:29:22,389 --> 02:29:21,120
thank you for the reminder yeah i forgot

3643
02:29:24,389 --> 02:29:22,399
about that yeah

3644
02:29:26,150 --> 02:29:24,399
so anyway a little bit we're getting off

3645
02:29:27,990 --> 02:29:26,160
the track here i don't want it no well

3646
02:29:30,469 --> 02:29:28,000
so i guess the overall take though i

3647
02:29:32,710 --> 02:29:30,479
mean how do you think history

3648
02:29:35,429 --> 02:29:32,720
um you know three four years from now is

3649
02:29:36,389 --> 02:29:35,439
going to look look back at this and not

3650
02:29:37,750 --> 02:29:36,399
only

3651
02:29:39,830 --> 02:29:37,760
uh you know the

3652
02:29:41,990 --> 02:29:39,840
the the community in the world looking

3653
02:29:42,870 --> 02:29:42,000
at this this series

3654
02:29:44,950 --> 02:29:42,880
um

3655
02:29:46,790 --> 02:29:44,960
but the participants

3656
02:29:48,469 --> 02:29:46,800
you know i are

3657
02:29:50,950 --> 02:29:48,479
i couldn't get anybody to come on the

3658
02:29:52,469 --> 02:29:50,960
show tonight to talk about it

3659
02:29:53,910 --> 02:29:52,479
yeah

3660
02:29:55,030 --> 02:29:53,920
well that's a whole story there we're

3661
02:29:57,030 --> 02:29:55,040
gonna have to figure out the reason for

3662
02:29:59,510 --> 02:29:57,040
that or you can do that but

3663
02:30:00,230 --> 02:29:59,520
yeah like why they why they wouldn't do

3664
02:30:04,469 --> 02:30:00,240
it

3665
02:30:06,790 --> 02:30:04,479
that was a whole list of pasts

3666
02:30:09,110 --> 02:30:06,800
you know from friends

3667
02:30:10,469 --> 02:30:09,120
i was like what yeah

3668
02:30:12,469 --> 02:30:10,479
you know what you have to do for in the

3669
02:30:14,710 --> 02:30:12,479
future this is my advice to you you just

3670
02:30:15,630 --> 02:30:14,720
say the following sentence hey do you

3671
02:30:17,590 --> 02:30:15,640
know who i

3672
02:30:19,830 --> 02:30:17,600
[Laughter]

3673
02:30:21,270 --> 02:30:19,840
or am love that they respond positively

3674
02:30:22,870 --> 02:30:21,280
to them oh they do

3675
02:30:24,870 --> 02:30:22,880
i assume

3676
02:30:27,590 --> 02:30:24,880
i just tell them how important you are

3677
02:30:29,750 --> 02:30:27,600
and like i'm jimmy church

3678
02:30:31,429 --> 02:30:29,760
just do that that might do the trick but

3679
02:30:32,630 --> 02:30:31,439
no seriously your question like how will

3680
02:30:35,030 --> 02:30:32,640
this be

3681
02:30:36,950 --> 02:30:35,040
uh perceived and

3682
02:30:38,309 --> 02:30:36,960
it i mean here's i

3683
02:30:40,070 --> 02:30:38,319
i believe and i think many people

3684
02:30:42,550 --> 02:30:40,080
listening probably believe that there is

3685
02:30:46,070 --> 02:30:42,560
very advanced technology that

3686
02:30:47,990 --> 02:30:46,080
that is in places like area 51 or s4 or

3687
02:30:49,110 --> 02:30:48,000
elsewhere tonopah probably a lot of

3688
02:30:51,510 --> 02:30:49,120
other places

3689
02:30:54,630 --> 02:30:51,520
yes very likely the real question though

3690
02:30:56,710 --> 02:30:54,640
is does that explain our ufo phenomenon

3691
02:30:58,790 --> 02:30:56,720
and i just have to say the answer

3692
02:31:01,110 --> 02:30:58,800
certainly appears to be no

3693
02:31:02,790 --> 02:31:01,120
every level that i look at it so i think

3694
02:31:05,030 --> 02:31:02,800
uh i don't think history is going to be

3695
02:31:07,429 --> 02:31:05,040
kind of this series for that reason and

3696
02:31:09,110 --> 02:31:07,439
also with abductions

3697
02:31:10,790 --> 02:31:09,120
you know they they

3698
02:31:12,389 --> 02:31:10,800
like john mack was a big part of that

3699
02:31:13,670 --> 02:31:12,399
and ralph blumenthal talked about john

3700
02:31:15,270 --> 02:31:13,680
mackie wrote a book about john mack

3701
02:31:16,150 --> 02:31:15,280
blumenthal is very sympathetic to john

3702
02:31:18,230 --> 02:31:16,160
mack

3703
02:31:20,950 --> 02:31:18,240
uh but the way that they

3704
02:31:22,469 --> 02:31:20,960
portrayed john mack and to lesser extent

3705
02:31:24,070 --> 02:31:22,479
but hopkins

3706
02:31:25,590 --> 02:31:24,080
was like

3707
02:31:26,950 --> 02:31:25,600
you get the sense that they were deluded

3708
02:31:28,630 --> 02:31:26,960
like there was that whole point about

3709
02:31:30,309 --> 02:31:28,640
well a psychiatrist is supposed to

3710
02:31:32,710 --> 02:31:30,319
believe his people he's supposed to

3711
02:31:34,950 --> 02:31:32,720
identify with him and so there's this

3712
02:31:37,670 --> 02:31:34,960
gentle way of sort of saying to people

3713
02:31:39,190 --> 02:31:37,680
yeah john mack nice guy smart guy but he

3714
02:31:41,429 --> 02:31:39,200
went a little off the rails like that's

3715
02:31:43,510 --> 02:31:41,439
really the impression the show gives you

3716
02:31:44,630 --> 02:31:43,520
about john mack yes and i think that's

3717
02:31:46,070 --> 02:31:44,640
demeaning

3718
02:31:47,670 --> 02:31:46,080
frankly

3719
02:31:49,349 --> 02:31:47,680
it wasn't entirely that way there was

3720
02:31:50,469 --> 02:31:49,359
enough there were enough clips of john

3721
02:31:51,750 --> 02:31:50,479
mack

3722
02:31:53,910 --> 02:31:51,760
speaking

3723
02:31:57,349 --> 02:31:53,920
where you you get at least a decent

3724
02:31:59,190 --> 02:31:57,359
sense of the man so but no i think you

3725
02:32:01,750 --> 02:31:59,200
know when you have a a

3726
02:32:03,349 --> 02:32:01,760
beautifully done series that's

3727
02:32:05,349 --> 02:32:03,359
essentially saying yes the ufo

3728
02:32:08,150 --> 02:32:05,359
phenomenon is real

3729
02:32:10,230 --> 02:32:08,160
there's a real phenomenon there but

3730
02:32:11,750 --> 02:32:10,240
doesn't look like it's aliens and no

3731
02:32:14,550 --> 02:32:11,760
one's being abducted

3732
02:32:17,270 --> 02:32:14,560
that's the message that is the message

3733
02:32:19,270 --> 02:32:17,280
and to me that's disinformation

3734
02:32:21,670 --> 02:32:19,280
they could have

3735
02:32:25,110 --> 02:32:21,680
um and you know you take the 60 minutes

3736
02:32:28,870 --> 02:32:25,120
approach to this where you clearly

3737
02:32:31,030 --> 02:32:28,880
and simply and succinctly present both

3738
02:32:33,910 --> 02:32:31,040
sides of the story so everybody can

3739
02:32:34,790 --> 02:32:33,920
understand what is going on you've got

3740
02:32:39,830 --> 02:32:34,800
this

3741
02:32:42,710 --> 02:32:39,840
it they didn't do that with abductions

3742
02:32:45,270 --> 02:32:42,720
that immediately got off on the wrong

3743
02:32:46,870 --> 02:32:45,280
foot and they stayed with that they

3744
02:32:50,230 --> 02:32:46,880
didn't talk about

3745
02:32:53,030 --> 02:32:50,240
uh the the amount of people that have

3746
02:32:55,030 --> 02:32:53,040
taught you know the the amount of evid

3747
02:32:56,950 --> 02:32:55,040
all of it they did the testament they

3748
02:32:58,150 --> 02:32:56,960
didn't talk about any of that well yeah

3749
02:32:59,590 --> 02:32:58,160
they could have gone into like they

3750
02:33:01,510 --> 02:32:59,600
talked about betty and barney hill but

3751
02:33:02,870 --> 02:33:01,520
actually they did a very superficial job

3752
02:33:05,349 --> 02:33:02,880
of talking about betty and barnhill

3753
02:33:07,030 --> 02:33:05,359
frankly uh ditto travis walton those

3754
02:33:10,070 --> 02:33:07,040
those cases were discussed but they were

3755
02:33:11,349 --> 02:33:10,080
very superficially covered so the actual

3756
02:33:13,429 --> 02:33:11,359
evidence

3757
02:33:16,150 --> 02:33:13,439
that would make you think holy crap they

3758
02:33:19,670 --> 02:33:16,160
were taken none of that was presented no

3759
02:33:21,510 --> 02:33:19,680
and and the uh the tapes the audio that

3760
02:33:23,670 --> 02:33:21,520
they presented from betty and barney

3761
02:33:25,270 --> 02:33:23,680
hill uh a short clip of betty and a

3762
02:33:27,270 --> 02:33:25,280
short clip of barney

3763
02:33:29,990 --> 02:33:27,280
absolutely presented them as crazy

3764
02:33:31,910 --> 02:33:30,000
people and i found that very offensive

3765
02:33:33,190 --> 02:33:31,920
yeah she was like she didn't think about

3766
02:33:34,950 --> 02:33:33,200
that but yes

3767
02:33:36,870 --> 02:33:34,960
my sense is that they had been portrayed

3768
02:33:38,870 --> 02:33:36,880
somewhat sympathetically

3769
02:33:40,790 --> 02:33:38,880
but that thing you're talking about yeah

3770
02:33:42,469 --> 02:33:40,800
i think you i think you're right yeah

3771
02:33:44,630 --> 02:33:42,479
betty talking about the size of the

3772
02:33:46,309 --> 02:33:44,640
needle right what does that have to do

3773
02:33:48,710 --> 02:33:46,319
with anything it just makes her sound

3774
02:33:51,110 --> 02:33:48,720
crazy and then barney freaking out that

3775
02:33:53,990 --> 02:33:51,120
he had to go find his gun

3776
02:33:55,510 --> 02:33:54,000
that was the clip that they used

3777
02:33:57,510 --> 02:33:55,520
i mean the thing that the reality is

3778
02:34:00,070 --> 02:33:57,520
that barney was deeply upset and

3779
02:34:02,309 --> 02:34:00,080
traumatized by the event

3780
02:34:04,389 --> 02:34:02,319
and during the regressions barney in

3781
02:34:06,469 --> 02:34:04,399
particular was i mean it was very

3782
02:34:08,710 --> 02:34:06,479
upsetting for him it was upsetting for

3783
02:34:10,469 --> 02:34:08,720
me it was upsetting

3784
02:34:13,110 --> 02:34:10,479
when you listen to those

3785
02:34:14,630 --> 02:34:13,120
those tapes of barney hill

3786
02:34:16,870 --> 02:34:14,640
actually yeah you can't help but be

3787
02:34:20,309 --> 02:34:16,880
uncomfortable and empathetic

3788
02:34:22,950 --> 02:34:20,319
and and also there was great detail

3789
02:34:24,630 --> 02:34:22,960
that was in those sessions i mean it was

3790
02:34:26,710 --> 02:34:24,640
it was cinematic

3791
02:34:28,710 --> 02:34:26,720
but instead they used the clip of of

3792
02:34:31,110 --> 02:34:28,720
barney yelling that he's got to find his

3793
02:34:32,469 --> 02:34:31,120
gun yeah yeah it's actually thinking i

3794
02:34:33,830 --> 02:34:32,479
didn't really consider until we're

3795
02:34:36,389 --> 02:34:33,840
talking about it but i think yeah the

3796
02:34:39,910 --> 02:34:36,399
treatments were were very superficial

3797
02:34:41,510 --> 02:34:39,920
and and really the emphasis was on

3798
02:34:43,190 --> 02:34:41,520
uh honestly this is like what the air

3799
02:34:45,190 --> 02:34:43,200
force used to do with blue book explain

3800
02:34:47,670 --> 02:34:45,200
away rather than explain

3801
02:34:48,950 --> 02:34:47,680
and they okay so let's let's back up for

3802
02:34:49,830 --> 02:34:48,960
a second

3803
02:34:51,990 --> 02:34:49,840
um

3804
02:34:53,910 --> 02:34:52,000
uh and i know that we're

3805
02:34:55,590 --> 02:34:53,920
we're we're running late richard and i

3806
02:34:57,110 --> 02:34:55,600
appreciate this but if we go back to

3807
02:35:00,150 --> 02:34:57,120
episode one

3808
02:35:02,790 --> 02:35:00,160
and the way that john greenwald uh

3809
02:35:05,590 --> 02:35:02,800
presents uh project blue book

3810
02:35:07,590 --> 02:35:05,600
and and they go back and they analyze

3811
02:35:09,270 --> 02:35:07,600
one of the things that

3812
02:35:12,950 --> 02:35:09,280
john pointed out

3813
02:35:15,030 --> 02:35:12,960
that um uh and i think they

3814
02:35:17,830 --> 02:35:15,040
they used a quote from jay allen heineck

3815
02:35:20,870 --> 02:35:17,840
i could be wrong but that

3816
02:35:22,389 --> 02:35:20,880
project blue book's job wasn't to

3817
02:35:24,070 --> 02:35:22,399
investigate

3818
02:35:26,550 --> 02:35:24,080
ufos

3819
02:35:27,870 --> 02:35:26,560
that wasn't their their

3820
02:35:31,030 --> 02:35:27,880
job was to

3821
02:35:33,030 --> 02:35:31,040
explain away and i think john did say

3822
02:35:35,670 --> 02:35:33,040
that and john was really on point about

3823
02:35:38,070 --> 02:35:35,680
that yes he was he did a good job i

3824
02:35:40,710 --> 02:35:38,080
thought in covering all of that you know

3825
02:35:42,389 --> 02:35:40,720
in a very succinct way and that's true i

3826
02:35:44,550 --> 02:35:42,399
mean they did make that statement in

3827
02:35:45,990 --> 02:35:44,560
that first episode that blue book's job

3828
02:35:48,230 --> 02:35:46,000
was to explain

3829
02:35:50,550 --> 02:35:48,240
not to investigate

3830
02:35:51,990 --> 02:35:50,560
yeah blue book didn't have the staff i

3831
02:35:54,150 --> 02:35:52,000
mean there was only one year in blue

3832
02:35:55,510 --> 02:35:54,160
books history in 1952 under captain

3833
02:35:57,910 --> 02:35:55,520
edward rupelt where they actually had

3834
02:36:00,469 --> 02:35:57,920
more than 10 guys like who were able to

3835
02:36:02,389 --> 02:36:00,479
do any kind of investigation and reports

3836
02:36:04,070 --> 02:36:02,399
after that the staff was cut down to

3837
02:36:05,590 --> 02:36:04,080
bare bones like nothing like four or

3838
02:36:08,469 --> 02:36:05,600
five people at the most yeah they had a

3839
02:36:09,910 --> 02:36:08,479
research assistant a secretary clintonia

3840
02:36:12,790 --> 02:36:09,920
and heinek

3841
02:36:15,190 --> 02:36:12,800
yeah and then uh a couple of people that

3842
02:36:15,990 --> 02:36:15,200
came in to help from the outside

3843
02:36:18,389 --> 02:36:16,000
you know

3844
02:36:20,550 --> 02:36:18,399
they utilized uh people over at air

3845
02:36:22,309 --> 02:36:20,560
force base in colorado who were you know

3846
02:36:25,110 --> 02:36:22,319
there was there were other divisions it

3847
02:36:26,870 --> 02:36:25,120
was a 4166 air division

3848
02:36:30,389 --> 02:36:26,880
that was doing ufo investigations in

3849
02:36:31,990 --> 02:36:30,399
late 50s but that was

3850
02:36:33,349 --> 02:36:32,000
that wasn't blue book those there was

3851
02:36:34,870 --> 02:36:33,359
they worked with blue book to some

3852
02:36:36,790 --> 02:36:34,880
extent but

3853
02:36:38,389 --> 02:36:36,800
that only lasted a few years anyway yeah

3854
02:36:39,990 --> 02:36:38,399
blue book was basically just it was

3855
02:36:42,309 --> 02:36:40,000
phenom window dressing

3856
02:36:44,790 --> 02:36:42,319
for show richard thank you so much

3857
02:36:46,950 --> 02:36:44,800
you've got a lot going on right now um

3858
02:36:49,510 --> 02:36:46,960
and i'm going to close with a couple of

3859
02:36:51,190 --> 02:36:49,520
basic questions one how's the new book

3860
02:36:52,389 --> 02:36:51,200
coming

3861
02:36:53,429 --> 02:36:52,399
um

3862
02:36:55,270 --> 02:36:53,439
great

3863
02:36:57,750 --> 02:36:55,280
can be better

3864
02:37:00,150 --> 02:36:57,760
how many pages did you do today

3865
02:37:01,110 --> 02:37:00,160
i work on other things than just my next

3866
02:37:03,030 --> 02:37:01,120
book

3867
02:37:04,389 --> 02:37:03,040
i have a website i got people i want to

3868
02:37:07,670 --> 02:37:04,399
keep happy on my website

3869
02:37:09,110 --> 02:37:07,680
i produce content there fairly regularly

3870
02:37:11,349 --> 02:37:09,120
um

3871
02:37:12,950 --> 02:37:11,359
so that takes my effort okay that's

3872
02:37:15,349 --> 02:37:12,960
important

3873
02:37:17,110 --> 02:37:15,359
but um

3874
02:37:18,950 --> 02:37:17,120
well my next question is getting back to

3875
02:37:20,630 --> 02:37:18,960
my volume 3 work i had made very good

3876
02:37:23,030 --> 02:37:20,640
progress earlier in the year on volume 3

3877
02:37:24,870 --> 02:37:23,040
and i will be getting back to it and

3878
02:37:25,910 --> 02:37:24,880
when do you uh

3879
02:37:28,790 --> 02:37:25,920
uh

3880
02:37:30,830 --> 02:37:28,800
do your live show

3881
02:37:33,750 --> 02:37:30,840
i think i'm going to do one tomorrow on

3882
02:37:35,830 --> 02:37:33,760
youtube yeah yeah i don't do them every

3883
02:37:38,070 --> 02:37:35,840
week uh the thing is it's it's a lot of

3884
02:37:39,670 --> 02:37:38,080
work for me to do it's

3885
02:37:42,870 --> 02:37:39,680
like i'm different from you like you

3886
02:37:44,710 --> 02:37:42,880
this is your thing and doing live radio

3887
02:37:46,950 --> 02:37:44,720
is it's not my primary thing it's

3888
02:37:48,870 --> 02:37:46,960
something that i like to do

3889
02:37:51,270 --> 02:37:48,880
i enjoy it when i do it but it takes a

3890
02:37:52,389 --> 02:37:51,280
lot of my time and effort and i can't

3891
02:37:54,070 --> 02:37:52,399
always

3892
02:37:55,590 --> 02:37:54,080
do it every single week so i do it when

3893
02:37:57,590 --> 02:37:55,600
i'm able to do it i think i'm going to

3894
02:38:00,070 --> 02:37:57,600
do a show tomorrow i think it's going to

3895
02:38:02,950 --> 02:38:00,080
be on google's jigsaw division working

3896
02:38:04,550 --> 02:38:02,960
with rand corporation to disable all

3897
02:38:05,910 --> 02:38:04,560
conspiracy theories on the web that's

3898
02:38:07,190 --> 02:38:05,920
actually something they're doing it's

3899
02:38:08,550 --> 02:38:07,200
nefarious

3900
02:38:09,590 --> 02:38:08,560
nasty

3901
02:38:13,990 --> 02:38:09,600
and

3902
02:38:15,830 --> 02:38:14,000
control totalitarian control yeah

3903
02:38:18,309 --> 02:38:15,840
google's connecting to the largest

3904
02:38:21,190 --> 02:38:18,319
defense think tank in the country

3905
02:38:23,190 --> 02:38:21,200
uh which they paid them to investigate

3906
02:38:26,230 --> 02:38:23,200
ways to

3907
02:38:29,510 --> 02:38:26,240
uh prevent conspiracy theories from

3908
02:38:31,270 --> 02:38:29,520
invading your mind and that nice oh that

3909
02:38:33,910 --> 02:38:31,280
is going to talk about that tomorrow and

3910
02:38:35,590 --> 02:38:33,920
by the way one of the uh four

3911
02:38:39,349 --> 02:38:35,600
sample conspiracy theories that ran

3912
02:38:40,550 --> 02:38:39,359
studied for this project were ufo people

3913
02:38:44,469 --> 02:38:40,560
now we

3914
02:38:48,309 --> 02:38:44,479
are doing uh a conference coming up uh

3915
02:38:50,630 --> 02:38:48,319
on the 18th uh making contact

3916
02:38:51,990 --> 02:38:50,640
and uh yeah we're both part of that yeah

3917
02:38:54,870 --> 02:38:52,000
we're both part of that and you know

3918
02:38:56,389 --> 02:38:54,880
what's interesting uh we've got eric

3919
02:38:58,550 --> 02:38:56,399
weinstein

3920
02:38:59,270 --> 02:38:58,560
that is that is coming in yeah that's

3921
02:39:01,750 --> 02:38:59,280
nice

3922
02:39:03,429 --> 02:39:01,760
smart guy that's a that's pretty strong

3923
02:39:05,110 --> 02:39:03,439
and i don't know what he knows about ufo

3924
02:39:06,550 --> 02:39:05,120
i think he's a friend of danny sheehan

3925
02:39:08,870 --> 02:39:06,560
and that's i think how he was brought in

3926
02:39:11,429 --> 02:39:08,880
if i'm not mistaken well he's also uh

3927
02:39:13,910 --> 02:39:11,439
you know a trained physicist and and

3928
02:39:17,110 --> 02:39:13,920
he's got a lot of uh a lot of

3929
02:39:18,950 --> 02:39:17,120
pragmatic thoughts of uh uh the universe

3930
02:39:20,630 --> 02:39:18,960
and and how things are very accomplished

3931
02:39:22,150 --> 02:39:20,640
very accomplished intelligent man yeah

3932
02:39:24,309 --> 02:39:22,160
yeah so eric weinstein i don't know what

3933
02:39:25,510 --> 02:39:24,319
his interest in ufos is uh that's

3934
02:39:27,670 --> 02:39:25,520
interesting

3935
02:39:29,990 --> 02:39:27,680
well we're gonna find out

3936
02:39:31,830 --> 02:39:30,000
and uh he's gonna be on fade to black i

3937
02:39:33,429 --> 02:39:31,840
don't want to give that away uh too

3938
02:39:36,309 --> 02:39:33,439
quickly here

3939
02:39:37,750 --> 02:39:36,319
but um i don't know

3940
02:39:39,590 --> 02:39:37,760
you know when you're when you're talking

3941
02:39:41,030 --> 02:39:39,600
to these physicists out there i've

3942
02:39:42,710 --> 02:39:41,040
always found it very interesting you

3943
02:39:45,429 --> 02:39:42,720
brought up this point earlier about

3944
02:39:46,469 --> 02:39:45,439
astra um uh astronomy

3945
02:39:47,830 --> 02:39:46,479
uh

3946
02:39:49,030 --> 02:39:47,840
intellectuals

3947
02:39:49,910 --> 02:39:49,040
is that

3948
02:39:53,349 --> 02:39:49,920
they

3949
02:39:55,910 --> 02:39:53,359
want you to understand the size of the

3950
02:39:58,309 --> 02:39:55,920
universe the size of the milky way

3951
02:40:00,150 --> 02:39:58,319
how many stars are out there

3952
02:40:02,950 --> 02:40:00,160
um chemistry

3953
02:40:05,190 --> 02:40:02,960
and that there must be

3954
02:40:07,990 --> 02:40:05,200
infinite amounts of life out there right

3955
02:40:09,990 --> 02:40:08,000
they want you to because it has to be

3956
02:40:12,230 --> 02:40:10,000
that way it's a numbers game and then

3957
02:40:15,429 --> 02:40:12,240
when you shift the gears

3958
02:40:18,469 --> 02:40:15,439
to talk about alien visitation to planet

3959
02:40:20,389 --> 02:40:18,479
earth that's the line in the sand

3960
02:40:21,670 --> 02:40:20,399
yeah well in earlier years by the way

3961
02:40:23,670 --> 02:40:21,680
you know it used to be standard for

3962
02:40:24,870 --> 02:40:23,680
astronomers to say there's no other life

3963
02:40:26,630 --> 02:40:24,880
in the universe and there are still

3964
02:40:27,990 --> 02:40:26,640
astronomers who maintain this finally

3965
02:40:30,469 --> 02:40:28,000
yes there are uh they're more of a

3966
02:40:32,710 --> 02:40:30,479
minority now but um

3967
02:40:33,750 --> 02:40:32,720
yeah i brought up astronomers look i i

3968
02:40:35,990 --> 02:40:33,760
don't

3969
02:40:38,469 --> 02:40:36,000
astronomy is wonderful we love astronomy

3970
02:40:39,910 --> 02:40:38,479
it's cool who doesn't love astronomy but

3971
02:40:41,910 --> 02:40:39,920
the thing is

3972
02:40:44,230 --> 02:40:41,920
astronomers get a free pass that they

3973
02:40:45,990 --> 02:40:44,240
don't deserve with ufos they just don't

3974
02:40:47,910 --> 02:40:46,000
deserve it and the reason is because we

3975
02:40:50,469 --> 02:40:47,920
think of ufos okay it's extraterrestrial

3976
02:40:52,790 --> 02:40:50,479
therefore astronomers must be expert but

3977
02:40:54,710 --> 02:40:52,800
the fact is astronomers where do you see

3978
02:40:56,790 --> 02:40:54,720
ufos but you don't see them in space

3979
02:40:58,389 --> 02:40:56,800
usually you see them in the atmosphere

3980
02:41:00,230 --> 02:40:58,399
so you want to talk to an atmospheric

3981
02:41:01,670 --> 02:41:00,240
physicist if you want to get scientific

3982
02:41:03,190 --> 02:41:01,680
about it or

3983
02:41:04,870 --> 02:41:03,200
talk to people who study ground traces

3984
02:41:06,150 --> 02:41:04,880
or how about this study to people who

3985
02:41:08,710 --> 02:41:06,160
are skilled in doing actual

3986
02:41:11,349 --> 02:41:08,720
investigations and looking at evidence

3987
02:41:12,469 --> 02:41:11,359
of ufos of which there's a

3988
02:41:15,110 --> 02:41:12,479
ton of it

3989
02:41:16,790 --> 02:41:15,120
astronomers are no better qualified

3990
02:41:19,830 --> 02:41:16,800
than anybody else

3991
02:41:21,910 --> 02:41:19,840
and but it's this idea that we have

3992
02:41:23,990 --> 02:41:21,920
oh yeah ufos extraterrestrial space

3993
02:41:25,429 --> 02:41:24,000
they're for astronomers

3994
02:41:28,070 --> 02:41:25,439
they don't know they don't know jack

3995
02:41:31,269 --> 02:41:28,080
about ufos i've how many of them

3996
02:41:33,670 --> 02:41:31,279
hynek was the only one heineck actually

3997
02:41:35,590 --> 02:41:33,680
was sophisticated about ufos because he

3998
02:41:37,510 --> 02:41:35,600
contracted the air force yeah he had the

3999
02:41:39,269 --> 02:41:37,520
whole swamp gas thing in 66 and he

4000
02:41:42,870 --> 02:41:39,279
looked bad with that but alan heineck

4001
02:41:45,030 --> 02:41:42,880
actually did know ufos extremely well he

4002
02:41:49,590 --> 02:41:45,040
was very sophisticated with it

4003
02:41:52,309 --> 02:41:49,600
um james mcdonald was an atmospheric guy

4004
02:41:54,150 --> 02:41:52,319
right he wasn't an astronomer oh said

4005
02:41:55,990 --> 02:41:54,160
james mcdonald yeah absolutely right

4006
02:41:58,389 --> 02:41:56,000
that's why mcdonald was able to bury

4007
02:42:00,790 --> 02:41:58,399
donald menzel in debates menzo the

4008
02:42:03,429 --> 02:42:00,800
astronomer at harvard big skeptic

4009
02:42:05,030 --> 02:42:03,439
macdonald tore him a new one repeatedly

4010
02:42:06,870 --> 02:42:05,040
embarrassed him in

4011
02:42:09,030 --> 02:42:06,880
article after article that's why philip

4012
02:42:10,550 --> 02:42:09,040
class basically made it his mission to

4013
02:42:12,550 --> 02:42:10,560
destroy the reputation of james

4014
02:42:14,469 --> 02:42:12,560
mcdonnell any way he could couldn't beat

4015
02:42:16,389 --> 02:42:14,479
him scientifically so they just

4016
02:42:19,269 --> 02:42:16,399
use smear tactics i mean really nasty

4017
02:42:22,230 --> 02:42:19,279
stuff but yes mcdonald was the real deal

4018
02:42:24,870 --> 02:42:22,240
and the other problem this is now not

4019
02:42:27,590 --> 02:42:24,880
every astronomer and not every physicist

4020
02:42:28,790 --> 02:42:27,600
but in a general sense

4021
02:42:31,670 --> 02:42:28,800
this is peter's rock he was an

4022
02:42:34,070 --> 02:42:31,680
astronomer on one of the good good side

4023
02:42:36,070 --> 02:42:34,080
but there are astronomers who are who

4024
02:42:37,750 --> 02:42:36,080
are good i mean i shouldn't i don't want

4025
02:42:39,910 --> 02:42:37,760
to take them all down no and i'm not

4026
02:42:42,309 --> 02:42:39,920
going to but i'm going to say this next

4027
02:42:43,269 --> 02:42:42,319
statement and i mean it

4028
02:42:46,150 --> 02:42:43,279
that

4029
02:42:47,830 --> 02:42:46,160
some of these physicists these rock star

4030
02:42:49,750 --> 02:42:47,840
physicists and these rock star

4031
02:42:50,790 --> 02:42:49,760
astronomers

4032
02:42:52,469 --> 02:42:50,800
um

4033
02:42:56,389 --> 02:42:52,479
try to

4034
02:42:59,110 --> 02:42:56,399
make themselves the last word because

4035
02:43:01,190 --> 02:42:59,120
they're so smart and they're smarter

4036
02:43:03,510 --> 02:43:01,200
than us and so you just said gail

4037
02:43:05,110 --> 02:43:03,520
degrasse tyson yes yes well he's one

4038
02:43:08,230 --> 02:43:05,120
let's just put the name out there okay

4039
02:43:10,150 --> 02:43:08,240
you're talking and that and that he

4040
02:43:13,429 --> 02:43:10,160
and and those like him

4041
02:43:15,750 --> 02:43:13,439
are smarter than us and we are stupid

4042
02:43:17,750 --> 02:43:15,760
and how could we be so stupid to believe

4043
02:43:20,469 --> 02:43:17,760
in these things when somebody like them

4044
02:43:22,469 --> 02:43:20,479
is telling you how it really is because

4045
02:43:24,790 --> 02:43:22,479
they're they are so smart

4046
02:43:27,510 --> 02:43:24,800
and i'm offended by that richard i am

4047
02:43:29,349 --> 02:43:27,520
completely offended well you're offended

4048
02:43:30,950 --> 02:43:29,359
for normal reason because it's obvious

4049
02:43:32,870 --> 02:43:30,960
when you hear tyson talk about ufos that

4050
02:43:35,349 --> 02:43:32,880
he doesn't know anything about it

4051
02:43:36,630 --> 02:43:35,359
it's obvious he does not know the

4052
02:43:38,309 --> 02:43:36,640
subject

4053
02:43:40,230 --> 02:43:38,319
when he talks about it

4054
02:43:41,910 --> 02:43:40,240
if he knew anything about the subject he

4055
02:43:43,590 --> 02:43:41,920
wouldn't sound as ignorant as he does

4056
02:43:45,670 --> 02:43:43,600
and he i'm sure he's a brilliant guy

4057
02:43:47,429 --> 02:43:45,680
he's probably way smarter than i am but

4058
02:43:48,710 --> 02:43:47,439
but uh and he knows astronomy he

4059
02:43:50,389 --> 02:43:48,720
probably knows a lot about the science

4060
02:43:52,790 --> 02:43:50,399
that i won't be able to compete with him

4061
02:43:54,389 --> 02:43:52,800
but he doesn't know ufos

4062
02:43:56,070 --> 02:43:54,399
doesn't know it and he embarrasses

4063
02:44:00,150 --> 02:43:56,080
himself without realizing when he talks

4064
02:44:02,389 --> 02:44:00,160
about it the um the one thing that neil

4065
02:44:03,510 --> 02:44:02,399
degrasse and others too he's not the

4066
02:44:04,950 --> 02:44:03,520
only one

4067
02:44:06,870 --> 02:44:04,960
but

4068
02:44:10,389 --> 02:44:06,880
is this

4069
02:44:13,269 --> 02:44:10,399
you cannot say to me

4070
02:44:15,750 --> 02:44:13,279
where is the proof of vt

4071
02:44:19,269 --> 02:44:15,760
when i can turn around and say to them

4072
02:44:20,469 --> 02:44:19,279
where is the proof that there is no life

4073
02:44:22,469 --> 02:44:20,479
elsewhere

4074
02:44:24,389 --> 02:44:22,479
you tell me that

4075
02:44:25,910 --> 02:44:24,399
what's the proof you you haven't been

4076
02:44:28,389 --> 02:44:25,920
off planet

4077
02:44:30,550 --> 02:44:28,399
you haven't done any analysis of

4078
02:44:32,710 --> 02:44:30,560
anything you haven't seen anything out

4079
02:44:35,349 --> 02:44:32,720
there everything that you are talking

4080
02:44:38,230 --> 02:44:35,359
about is your opinion

4081
02:44:40,469 --> 02:44:38,240
you have no scientific fact to back up

4082
02:44:41,990 --> 02:44:40,479
any of that a good scientist would agree

4083
02:44:44,550 --> 02:44:42,000
with you totally

4084
02:44:46,150 --> 02:44:44,560
i mean it's it's fair for a science for

4085
02:44:48,790 --> 02:44:46,160
an astronomer or an exobiologist or

4086
02:44:50,790 --> 02:44:48,800
whatever to infer

4087
02:44:52,790 --> 02:44:50,800
from the data that we're now getting so

4088
02:44:54,150 --> 02:44:52,800
there's you know we now have a pretty

4089
02:44:55,590 --> 02:44:54,160
good idea that yeah there's a lot of

4090
02:44:57,510 --> 02:44:55,600
stars that have planets and we're able

4091
02:44:59,349 --> 02:44:57,520
to figure out the wobble of the star and

4092
02:45:01,349 --> 02:44:59,359
the rotation and there's planets around

4093
02:45:03,590 --> 02:45:01,359
them okay fine and then and

4094
02:45:05,190 --> 02:45:03,600
i believe at least i'm willing to trust

4095
02:45:06,870 --> 02:45:05,200
that when they say

4096
02:45:08,550 --> 02:45:06,880
we believe there are planets like

4097
02:45:11,030 --> 02:45:08,560
earth-sized planets

4098
02:45:12,870 --> 02:45:11,040
okay fine fair enough so it's it's fine

4099
02:45:14,790 --> 02:45:12,880
to make an inference about the

4100
02:45:15,830 --> 02:45:14,800
likelihood of a lot of life out there i

4101
02:45:17,190 --> 02:45:15,840
think that's

4102
02:45:19,349 --> 02:45:17,200
most of them now believe that but they

4103
02:45:20,710 --> 02:45:19,359
wouldn't say that we have proof

4104
02:45:21,910 --> 02:45:20,720
um

4105
02:45:25,190 --> 02:45:21,920
but i think you know what they're

4106
02:45:26,469 --> 02:45:25,200
forgetting and what this show actually

4107
02:45:29,190 --> 02:45:26,479
forgets

4108
02:45:31,590 --> 02:45:29,200
ufo i i think of the ufo subject as like

4109
02:45:33,590 --> 02:45:31,600
a great zen teacher

4110
02:45:35,510 --> 02:45:33,600
like the subject itself is a teacher

4111
02:45:38,230 --> 02:45:35,520
it's like you go off you want you go on

4112
02:45:40,389 --> 02:45:38,240
to this spiritual retreat you want to

4113
02:45:42,070 --> 02:45:40,399
learn you want to become wise right you

4114
02:45:44,389 --> 02:45:42,080
want to become this wise person on hill

4115
02:45:46,309 --> 02:45:44,399
so you go off into the you go up the

4116
02:45:48,790 --> 02:45:46,319
hill you go into a cave and you you meet

4117
02:45:50,469 --> 02:45:48,800
the zen master so when you do that are

4118
02:45:52,389 --> 02:45:50,479
you going to say to this guy i want to

4119
02:45:55,349 --> 02:45:52,399
know everything right now because this

4120
02:45:56,950 --> 02:45:55,359
is easy tell me everything like that's

4121
02:45:58,790 --> 02:45:56,960
how arrogant

4122
02:46:02,389 --> 02:45:58,800
and yet this is how people treat the ufo

4123
02:46:05,510 --> 02:46:02,399
subject as if you can just go right in

4124
02:46:07,030 --> 02:46:05,520
and and get it all at once

4125
02:46:08,389 --> 02:46:07,040
i was foolish enough to think that

4126
02:46:09,910 --> 02:46:08,399
almost 30 years ago i thought i'm gonna

4127
02:46:11,510 --> 02:46:09,920
take two three months out of my life

4128
02:46:13,750 --> 02:46:11,520
i'll figure this out

4129
02:46:16,550 --> 02:46:13,760
and then i'll move on yeah okay that was

4130
02:46:18,550 --> 02:46:16,560
my fond arrogant belief back then but

4131
02:46:21,190 --> 02:46:18,560
what you learn is that this subject is

4132
02:46:22,630 --> 02:46:21,200
the great teacher and you go

4133
02:46:24,150 --> 02:46:22,640
what's your attitude you go in with

4134
02:46:26,469 --> 02:46:24,160
humility

4135
02:46:28,950 --> 02:46:26,479
and you go in realizing that this is a

4136
02:46:30,790 --> 02:46:28,960
steep learning curve and you're not just

4137
02:46:33,990 --> 02:46:30,800
going to solve it

4138
02:46:35,830 --> 02:46:34,000
right away that's that's arrogance and

4139
02:46:39,429 --> 02:46:35,840
and i feel

4140
02:46:41,110 --> 02:46:39,439
that many of these academic scientists

4141
02:46:43,269 --> 02:46:41,120
they that seems to be their attitude

4142
02:46:46,150 --> 02:46:43,279
they underestimate the complexity and

4143
02:46:48,309 --> 02:46:46,160
depth and subtlety and profundity of the

4144
02:46:49,910 --> 02:46:48,319
ufo phenomenon

4145
02:46:52,150 --> 02:46:49,920
i mean this this stuff will rip open

4146
02:46:53,990 --> 02:46:52,160
your paradigm not just once like i love

4147
02:46:56,710 --> 02:46:54,000
to use the analogy of the matrix you

4148
02:46:58,790 --> 02:46:56,720
know neo takes the red pill changes his

4149
02:47:01,030 --> 02:46:58,800
reality yeah i wish you were that simple

4150
02:47:03,510 --> 02:47:01,040
one red pill it doesn't work like that

4151
02:47:05,269 --> 02:47:03,520
this subject rips through your paradigm

4152
02:47:07,110 --> 02:47:05,279
multiple times

4153
02:47:10,070 --> 02:47:07,120
and it humbles you if you really think

4154
02:47:12,070 --> 02:47:10,080
you've got it figured out so humility is

4155
02:47:13,910 --> 02:47:12,080
the proper attitude to take when

4156
02:47:15,750 --> 02:47:13,920
confronting this

4157
02:47:17,670 --> 02:47:15,760
think about all the obstacles that we're

4158
02:47:20,389 --> 02:47:17,680
facing with this subject the subject is

4159
02:47:21,429 --> 02:47:20,399
intrinsically difficult i mean we're

4160
02:47:24,790 --> 02:47:21,439
dealing

4161
02:47:26,630 --> 02:47:24,800
clearly or most almost certainly with an

4162
02:47:28,389 --> 02:47:26,640
intelligence that's beyond ours that's

4163
02:47:30,070 --> 02:47:28,399
operating on a level of where we're not

4164
02:47:31,830 --> 02:47:30,080
quite there they seem to be able to

4165
02:47:33,910 --> 02:47:31,840
manipulate space and time in ways that

4166
02:47:35,590 --> 02:47:33,920
we don't really quite get they're doing

4167
02:47:38,230 --> 02:47:35,600
things that are

4168
02:47:40,870 --> 02:47:38,240
subterranean and covert they don't want

4169
02:47:42,230 --> 02:47:40,880
to be outed right so there's that that

4170
02:47:44,150 --> 02:47:42,240
whole thing that's a challenge enough

4171
02:47:45,830 --> 02:47:44,160
then you got the secrecy on our part of

4172
02:47:47,910 --> 02:47:45,840
our governments and the intelligence

4173
02:47:50,710 --> 02:47:47,920
community and the privatized nature of

4174
02:47:52,630 --> 02:47:50,720
that secrecy which is just i call it

4175
02:47:53,750 --> 02:47:52,640
legal illegality

4176
02:47:56,389 --> 02:47:53,760
you know it's like these private

4177
02:47:57,190 --> 02:47:56,399
corporations lockheed north or

4178
02:47:58,710 --> 02:47:57,200
uh

4179
02:48:00,309 --> 02:47:58,720
you know boeing and

4180
02:48:02,389 --> 02:48:00,319
raytheon and all like they're they're

4181
02:48:03,349 --> 02:48:02,399
all protected by the black budget

4182
02:48:05,830 --> 02:48:03,359
structure of the united states

4183
02:48:08,309 --> 02:48:05,840
government no one can get these guys so

4184
02:48:10,550 --> 02:48:08,319
you just like we have everything going

4185
02:48:11,429 --> 02:48:10,560
against us and and on top of that

4186
02:48:17,590 --> 02:48:11,439
there's

4187
02:48:19,269 --> 02:48:17,600
and it could be by these others it could

4188
02:48:21,910 --> 02:48:19,279
be by our our

4189
02:48:24,150 --> 02:48:21,920
hierarchical bettors or both

4190
02:48:25,910 --> 02:48:24,160
in some way or another so we've we've

4191
02:48:28,389 --> 02:48:25,920
got our work cut out for us

4192
02:48:30,150 --> 02:48:28,399
and yes people are being taken people

4193
02:48:32,469 --> 02:48:30,160
are being interacted with by these

4194
02:48:34,469 --> 02:48:32,479
beings you know i'm sorry but that that

4195
02:48:36,630 --> 02:48:34,479
last episode that actually was really

4196
02:48:38,469 --> 02:48:36,640
demeaning to people who've had abduction

4197
02:48:40,150 --> 02:48:38,479
experiences you know the more i think

4198
02:48:43,030 --> 02:48:40,160
about it i kind of rushed through it i

4199
02:48:45,830 --> 02:48:43,040
blew through that last episode at almost

4200
02:48:48,870 --> 02:48:45,840
2x speed i had subtitles so i was able

4201
02:48:50,309 --> 02:48:48,880
to follow but anyway um

4202
02:48:51,590 --> 02:48:50,319
yes it

4203
02:48:53,910 --> 02:48:51,600
like

4204
02:48:55,510 --> 02:48:53,920
this is a very very complicated

4205
02:48:57,429 --> 02:48:55,520
difficult subject

4206
02:48:59,590 --> 02:48:57,439
and and what's offensive to you and to

4207
02:49:01,030 --> 02:48:59,600
me is when people think they can just

4208
02:49:02,630 --> 02:49:01,040
waltz right in and say oh yeah i got

4209
02:49:04,150 --> 02:49:02,640
this all figured out this is what you're

4210
02:49:06,309 --> 02:49:04,160
dealing with

4211
02:49:07,910 --> 02:49:06,319
like you know once you put some work in

4212
02:49:10,230 --> 02:49:07,920
and then come back in about 10 years and

4213
02:49:11,429 --> 02:49:10,240
then talk to us do you think uh jj

4214
02:49:13,349 --> 02:49:11,439
abrams

4215
02:49:15,830 --> 02:49:13,359
had that mindset

4216
02:49:17,750 --> 02:49:15,840
i mean it's it's so simple it's it's so

4217
02:49:18,550 --> 02:49:17,760
such a simple it's like occam's razor

4218
02:49:21,269 --> 02:49:18,560
right

4219
02:49:22,469 --> 02:49:21,279
did he just jump into this too quick

4220
02:49:23,990 --> 02:49:22,479
thinking

4221
02:49:25,349 --> 02:49:24,000
that this

4222
02:49:28,710 --> 02:49:25,359
you know not only that he had the

4223
02:49:31,349 --> 02:49:28,720
answers but that it has to be this way

4224
02:49:34,230 --> 02:49:31,359
and he went with it without without

4225
02:49:35,990 --> 02:49:34,240
backing up and and being uh certainly

4226
02:49:37,429 --> 02:49:36,000
much more objective

4227
02:49:38,870 --> 02:49:37,439
either that or in 20 years we'll find

4228
02:49:40,150 --> 02:49:38,880
out he did a kind of robertson panel

4229
02:49:43,190 --> 02:49:40,160
sort of thing you know working for some

4230
02:49:44,230 --> 02:49:43,200
group i mean look we we know for a fact

4231
02:49:46,150 --> 02:49:44,240
that

4232
02:49:48,150 --> 02:49:46,160
the us military and the cia have had

4233
02:49:49,990 --> 02:49:48,160
hollywood connections

4234
02:49:51,429 --> 02:49:50,000
they have and they do and in fact they

4235
02:49:53,269 --> 02:49:51,439
can be very heavy-handed over

4236
02:49:56,630 --> 02:49:53,279
manipulation of scripts

4237
02:49:59,030 --> 02:49:56,640
and we know this this is not this is not

4238
02:50:01,349 --> 02:49:59,040
fantasy or conspiracy theory which is a

4239
02:50:05,110 --> 02:50:01,359
self a cia phrase from 1967 but we'll

4240
02:50:08,230 --> 02:50:05,120
move on no this is actual reality okay

4241
02:50:10,630 --> 02:50:08,240
so that relationship is real and who the

4242
02:50:11,990 --> 02:50:10,640
hell knows like which documentary comes

4243
02:50:13,910 --> 02:50:12,000
out that's got

4244
02:50:15,670 --> 02:50:13,920
intelligence connections behind the

4245
02:50:17,269 --> 02:50:15,680
scenes how

4246
02:50:19,990 --> 02:50:17,279
you know these things are it's very

4247
02:50:22,389 --> 02:50:20,000
difficult to figure this stuff out

4248
02:50:25,190 --> 02:50:22,399
so i don't know i i have no idea what

4249
02:50:26,070 --> 02:50:25,200
abram's actual beliefs are in this at

4250
02:50:28,309 --> 02:50:26,080
all

4251
02:50:30,389 --> 02:50:28,319
but he i mean you're judging on the

4252
02:50:32,230 --> 02:50:30,399
basis of this four-parter that we're

4253
02:50:35,030 --> 02:50:32,240
talking about

4254
02:50:36,710 --> 02:50:35,040
seems to me he's uh

4255
02:50:38,630 --> 02:50:36,720
is playing a role

4256
02:50:40,309 --> 02:50:38,640
that's what it looks like

4257
02:50:42,630 --> 02:50:40,319
and and i want to make it clear like i'm

4258
02:50:44,870 --> 02:50:42,640
not accusing anyone who's participated

4259
02:50:47,110 --> 02:50:44,880
in this of anything

4260
02:50:48,870 --> 02:50:47,120
uh less than honorable i think i think

4261
02:50:51,349 --> 02:50:48,880
john greenwald comported himself

4262
02:50:53,590 --> 02:50:51,359
extremely well leslie kane ditto ralph

4263
02:50:55,910 --> 02:50:53,600
blumenthal kevin day

4264
02:50:57,830 --> 02:50:55,920
diana pasulka all and all the others

4265
02:50:59,670 --> 02:50:57,840
like even the people that i found myself

4266
02:51:01,269 --> 02:50:59,680
disagreeing with

4267
02:51:03,269 --> 02:51:01,279
except the two people from penn state i

4268
02:51:05,190 --> 02:51:03,279
don't know anything about them

4269
02:51:07,110 --> 02:51:05,200
i don't know their background but they

4270
02:51:08,950 --> 02:51:07,120
you know everyone

4271
02:51:12,150 --> 02:51:08,960
came across

4272
02:51:13,429 --> 02:51:12,160
george knapp you know they they did well

4273
02:51:15,990 --> 02:51:13,439
so

4274
02:51:17,670 --> 02:51:16,000
never trying to criticize them uh it's

4275
02:51:20,150 --> 02:51:17,680
it's what was the

4276
02:51:21,670 --> 02:51:20,160
overall direction of this four-parter

4277
02:51:23,030 --> 02:51:21,680
and

4278
02:51:25,269 --> 02:51:23,040
it's funny like when i started this

4279
02:51:27,110 --> 02:51:25,279
interview with you tonight like i

4280
02:51:29,590 --> 02:51:27,120
i wasn't thinking this as strongly as i

4281
02:51:31,510 --> 02:51:29,600
am right this minute but i think

4282
02:51:33,670 --> 02:51:31,520
this looks to me like it was

4283
02:51:35,910 --> 02:51:33,680
it looks like this information

4284
02:51:37,670 --> 02:51:35,920
i'm just going to be honest about it

4285
02:51:39,590 --> 02:51:37,680
you know good and there's good data in

4286
02:51:40,870 --> 02:51:39,600
there and it's worth watching but i

4287
02:51:43,429 --> 02:51:40,880
think

4288
02:51:45,429 --> 02:51:43,439
you've got to be aware like what is

4289
02:51:46,950 --> 02:51:45,439
actually the intention

4290
02:51:49,110 --> 02:51:46,960
of this what is the takeaway and i think

4291
02:51:51,510 --> 02:51:49,120
the takeaway is yeah there's ufos but

4292
02:51:53,429 --> 02:51:51,520
they're we're we're probably making them

4293
02:51:55,590 --> 02:51:53,439
and there's no abductions

4294
02:51:57,910 --> 02:51:55,600
you know for those out there

4295
02:51:58,830 --> 02:51:57,920
for those out there

4296
02:52:00,790 --> 02:51:58,840
that

4297
02:52:02,230 --> 02:52:00,800
uh

4298
02:52:06,309 --> 02:52:02,240
support

4299
02:52:11,309 --> 02:52:06,319
the nimitz roosevelt

4300
02:52:14,309 --> 02:52:11,319
uh narrative that the tic tac uh was e.t

4301
02:52:15,990 --> 02:52:14,319
extraterrestrial or certainly backwards

4302
02:52:18,230 --> 02:52:16,000
and you know alternate backwards

4303
02:52:20,309 --> 02:52:18,240
engineered alien attack is another way

4304
02:52:23,190 --> 02:52:20,319
to look at it but that's that is

4305
02:52:26,070 --> 02:52:23,200
terrestrial that's us that is an e.t but

4306
02:52:29,030 --> 02:52:26,080
for those out there that have been on

4307
02:52:30,950 --> 02:52:29,040
board with all of this and excited about

4308
02:52:32,790 --> 02:52:30,960
the days of disclosure

4309
02:52:36,469 --> 02:52:32,800
they're going to turn around and watch

4310
02:52:39,750 --> 02:52:36,479
this and back up going wait a minute

4311
02:52:41,269 --> 02:52:39,760
this isn't what i have supported this

4312
02:52:43,750 --> 02:52:41,279
this right here

4313
02:52:45,830 --> 02:52:43,760
is taking this in the wrong direction

4314
02:52:47,990 --> 02:52:45,840
and and think about that huge part of

4315
02:52:50,630 --> 02:52:48,000
the community right now

4316
02:52:51,910 --> 02:52:50,640
um that would be very disappointed in

4317
02:52:53,830 --> 02:52:51,920
the way that this

4318
02:52:56,550 --> 02:52:53,840
this is painting the picture

4319
02:52:59,510 --> 02:52:56,560
it's this is not part of

4320
02:53:02,070 --> 02:52:59,520
modern disclosure that they thought that

4321
02:53:02,950 --> 02:53:02,080
this this presentation was going to be

4322
02:53:08,950 --> 02:53:02,960
right

4323
02:53:11,510 --> 02:53:08,960
and you know especially like i said

4324
02:53:12,710 --> 02:53:11,520
i watched episode one i was like here we

4325
02:53:17,590 --> 02:53:12,720
go

4326
02:53:19,670 --> 02:53:17,600
episode yeah man and episode two

4327
02:53:21,830 --> 02:53:19,680
you know and i was like okay all right

4328
02:53:24,389 --> 02:53:21,840
and then wow

4329
02:53:26,710 --> 02:53:24,399
right i i

4330
02:53:29,910 --> 02:53:26,720
so surprised richard thank you so much

4331
02:53:32,550 --> 02:53:29,920
my friend and uh let's talk soon we've

4332
02:53:34,230 --> 02:53:32,560
got a lot of work to do uh of course we

4333
02:53:37,190 --> 02:53:34,240
have making contact

4334
02:53:39,910 --> 02:53:37,200
uh that week uh that's august 18th 19th

4335
02:53:41,830 --> 02:53:39,920
20th 21st and 22nd

4336
02:53:44,990 --> 02:53:41,840
um oh yes we got to promote that i'm

4337
02:53:47,110 --> 02:53:45,000
going to put up a banner on my site

4338
02:53:48,469 --> 02:53:47,120
makingcontact.com thank you so much by

4339
02:53:51,030 --> 02:53:48,479
the way i want to say a big shout out to

4340
02:53:52,950 --> 02:53:51,040
the fader knots who are awesome and any

4341
02:53:55,429 --> 02:53:52,960
any folks in richard nolan members who

4342
02:53:57,830 --> 02:53:55,439
came out here to check this out

4343
02:54:00,150 --> 02:53:57,840
hello yeah right now richard i hated

4344
02:54:03,030 --> 02:54:00,160
that to those folks too he's got his mic

4345
02:54:04,070 --> 02:54:03,040
uh his harmonica in his hand and uh he's

4346
02:54:06,790 --> 02:54:04,080
ready

4347
02:54:08,870 --> 02:54:06,800
richard thank you hold it up what kind

4348
02:54:09,670 --> 02:54:08,880
is it is it a lee oscar

4349
02:54:11,110 --> 02:54:09,680
uh

4350
02:54:13,190 --> 02:54:11,120
i have a collection of lee oscar

4351
02:54:16,790 --> 02:54:13,200
harmonicas but this is a honer which is

4352
02:54:18,469 --> 02:54:16,800
a great a great heart very nice

4353
02:54:21,030 --> 02:54:18,479
i've got my lee oscar's running around

4354
02:54:22,950 --> 02:54:21,040
somewhere i can't keep track of them all

4355
02:54:25,590 --> 02:54:22,960
do you have do you have like a do you

4356
02:54:28,630 --> 02:54:25,600
have a gun holster that you put up yeah

4357
02:54:30,630 --> 02:54:28,640
i do you do you've got a harmonica belt

4358
02:54:31,590 --> 02:54:30,640
i do indeed yes

4359
02:54:33,830 --> 02:54:31,600
you know

4360
02:54:35,590 --> 02:54:33,840
i know i'm keeping you late so this is a

4361
02:54:38,710 --> 02:54:35,600
funny thing

4362
02:54:40,790 --> 02:54:38,720
uh 15 years ago

4363
02:54:42,950 --> 02:54:40,800
more than that probably

4364
02:54:44,230 --> 02:54:42,960
locally here in rochester new york do

4365
02:54:45,990 --> 02:54:44,240
you know what i did for a few years this

4366
02:54:47,510 --> 02:54:46,000
is i'm already a ufo author at this

4367
02:54:49,510 --> 02:54:47,520
point

4368
02:54:51,190 --> 02:54:49,520
i taught

4369
02:54:53,510 --> 02:54:51,200
adult

4370
02:54:57,429 --> 02:54:53,520
learner classes for like a year or two

4371
02:54:59,990 --> 02:54:57,439
on occasion on how to play the harmonica

4372
02:55:01,830 --> 02:55:00,000
i did i did ufo lectures first for like

4373
02:55:03,429 --> 02:55:01,840
local high schools this would be like i

4374
02:55:04,790 --> 02:55:03,439
just wanted to deal with like local

4375
02:55:05,910 --> 02:55:04,800
people right

4376
02:55:08,309 --> 02:55:05,920
and so i

4377
02:55:10,389 --> 02:55:08,319
i did these um i would do like lectures

4378
02:55:12,309 --> 02:55:10,399
on ufos and then one of the ladies at

4379
02:55:14,150 --> 02:55:12,319
one of the high schools like wow you're

4380
02:55:15,190 --> 02:55:14,160
really good at this can you do anything

4381
02:55:17,190 --> 02:55:15,200
else i'm like

4382
02:55:19,910 --> 02:55:17,200
yeah you know what i can do i'll bet you

4383
02:55:21,910 --> 02:55:19,920
i can teach any person how to play basic

4384
02:55:23,429 --> 02:55:21,920
harmonica you give me two hours and i'm

4385
02:55:26,150 --> 02:55:23,439
going to teach them how to play and she

4386
02:55:28,710 --> 02:55:26,160
said you're on and so for

4387
02:55:29,670 --> 02:55:28,720
a couple of years i swear to god i did

4388
02:55:31,750 --> 02:55:29,680
this

4389
02:55:33,030 --> 02:55:31,760
going to like some high school classroom

4390
02:55:35,349 --> 02:55:33,040
and all these people sitting in the

4391
02:55:36,710 --> 02:55:35,359
little desks right yeah and each had a

4392
02:55:38,070 --> 02:55:36,720
harmonica

4393
02:55:39,670 --> 02:55:38,080
and it's true though so like for the

4394
02:55:41,510 --> 02:55:39,680
first hour i taught them to play things

4395
02:55:43,349 --> 02:55:41,520
like a hunting we will go and marry had

4396
02:55:45,030 --> 02:55:43,359
a little i'm like basic things and in

4397
02:55:46,710 --> 02:55:45,040
the second hour

4398
02:55:48,309 --> 02:55:46,720
i taught them how to play blue's heart

4399
02:55:49,830 --> 02:55:48,319
blues harmonica

4400
02:55:51,830 --> 02:55:49,840
which is a different you know it's a

4401
02:55:52,790 --> 02:55:51,840
different style different technique

4402
02:55:54,230 --> 02:55:52,800
and

4403
02:55:55,990 --> 02:55:54,240
i'll just say like

4404
02:55:57,269 --> 02:55:56,000
some people did all right

4405
02:55:59,510 --> 02:55:57,279
and then after a while it's like there's

4406
02:56:00,389 --> 02:55:59,520
too much work like there's no money in

4407
02:56:02,309 --> 02:56:00,399
this

4408
02:56:03,830 --> 02:56:02,319
and it was a little bit of fun but i was

4409
02:56:06,389 --> 02:56:03,840
like ah

4410
02:56:08,950 --> 02:56:06,399
gotta move on man we got okay yeah we're

4411
02:56:12,309 --> 02:56:08,960
gonna do yeah yeah we need to do a a

4412
02:56:13,990 --> 02:56:12,319
live stream uh uh teaching everybody how

4413
02:56:16,790 --> 02:56:14,000
to play harmonica

4414
02:56:19,030 --> 02:56:16,800
and uh and bust that out man

4415
02:56:20,389 --> 02:56:19,040
i'm all down for that i'm all down for

4416
02:56:22,230 --> 02:56:20,399
it

4417
02:56:24,830 --> 02:56:22,240
richard thank you so much man we just

4418
02:56:27,429 --> 02:56:24,840
went uh pulled a poll and it was

4419
02:56:29,590 --> 02:56:27,439
unexpected yeah and i had a whole thing

4420
02:56:31,590 --> 02:56:29,600
i was going to take phone calls from

4421
02:56:34,070 --> 02:56:31,600
all of the distraught people out there

4422
02:56:36,389 --> 02:56:34,080
that went and saw the series and

4423
02:56:38,469 --> 02:56:36,399
and i had a whole plan but we'll save

4424
02:56:40,070 --> 02:56:38,479
all of that for fader night thank you so

4425
02:56:43,110 --> 02:56:40,080
much my friend i blew through the

4426
02:56:44,710 --> 02:56:43,120
commercials thank you uh kgra for

4427
02:56:47,429 --> 02:56:44,720
keeping us on the air

4428
02:56:49,349 --> 02:56:47,439
and and everybody else but it's all

4429
02:56:50,670 --> 02:56:49,359
simple to do i want everybody to go and

4430
02:56:52,230 --> 02:56:50,680
visit

4431
02:56:54,389 --> 02:56:52,240
richarddolenmembers.com

4432
02:56:57,110 --> 02:56:54,399
go and check it out get registered

4433
02:56:58,389 --> 02:56:57,120
and and go hang out with richard richard

4434
02:57:01,110 --> 02:56:58,399
there's a lot of free stuff in that site

4435
02:57:03,030 --> 02:57:01,120
too thank you so much my friend and uh

4436
02:57:05,910 --> 02:57:03,040
this episode

4437
02:57:08,309 --> 02:57:05,920
will be at richard dolan members

4438
02:57:09,750 --> 02:57:08,319
i i do that for richard so there you go

4439
02:57:11,510 --> 02:57:09,760
thank you thank you jimmy thank you so

4440
02:57:13,750 --> 02:57:11,520
much richard enjoy the rest of your

4441
02:57:16,230 --> 02:57:13,760
evening my friend go play that harp

4442
02:57:17,510 --> 02:57:16,240
i'm going to bed i'll talk to you

4443
02:57:19,429 --> 02:57:17,520
have a great night everyone you too

4444
02:57:22,070 --> 02:57:19,439
richard richard bleep and dolan thank

4445
02:57:24,230 --> 02:57:22,080
you richard and with that i'm gonna get

4446
02:57:27,429 --> 02:57:24,240
out of here we've got an amazing week

4447
02:57:30,230 --> 02:57:27,439
coming up here on fade to black not only

4448
02:57:33,830 --> 02:57:30,240
uh tonight with uh richard dolan and a

4449
02:57:37,830 --> 02:57:33,840
full analysis of showtime's ufo uh by

4450
02:57:40,150 --> 02:57:37,840
j.j abrams and again after listening to

4451
02:57:43,269 --> 02:57:40,160
our presentation tonight i encourage

4452
02:57:46,070 --> 02:57:43,279
everybody to go and watch all four

4453
02:57:47,910 --> 02:57:46,080
episodes i said earlier tonight in the

4454
02:57:49,510 --> 02:57:47,920
opening of the show

4455
02:57:52,469 --> 02:57:49,520
i may be wrong

4456
02:57:55,190 --> 02:57:52,479
i don't know i i i've now watched it

4457
02:57:58,070 --> 02:57:55,200
twice i've watched episode three three

4458
02:58:01,349 --> 02:57:58,080
times i need to go back and watch it all

4459
02:58:03,349 --> 02:58:01,359
again it seems

4460
02:58:05,750 --> 02:58:03,359
a little funky to me

4461
02:58:07,429 --> 02:58:05,760
but i need your analysis too and you may

4462
02:58:09,510 --> 02:58:07,439
look at it with a different set of eyes

4463
02:58:12,230 --> 02:58:09,520
and maybe i missed something and

4464
02:58:15,590 --> 02:58:12,240
and everybody can help me out but if

4465
02:58:18,550 --> 02:58:15,600
you're a subscriber to the showtime app

4466
02:58:20,790 --> 02:58:18,560
all four episodes are available to you

4467
02:58:24,230 --> 02:58:20,800
right now you can go and do that um

4468
02:58:27,030 --> 02:58:24,240
episode one is available on their

4469
02:58:29,190 --> 02:58:27,040
showtime youtube channel but i encourage

4470
02:58:32,950 --> 02:58:29,200
everybody to go and watch it all of the

4471
02:58:35,750 --> 02:58:32,960
presentations everything is done so well

4472
02:58:39,510 --> 02:58:35,760
it's shot so well um

4473
02:58:41,510 --> 02:58:39,520
uh it is at another level but overall

4474
02:58:43,670 --> 02:58:41,520
there's a flavor here

4475
02:58:45,590 --> 02:58:43,680
and i'm trying to figure it out all

4476
02:58:48,630 --> 02:58:45,600
right so i encourage everybody tomorrow

4477
02:58:50,870 --> 02:58:48,640
night right here stephen bassett we've

4478
02:58:53,349 --> 02:58:50,880
got this other series that just

4479
02:58:56,550 --> 02:58:53,359
premiered on netflix it is called secret

4480
02:58:58,630 --> 02:58:56,560
ufo projects it is trending right now on

4481
02:59:01,269 --> 02:58:58,640
netflix it's easy to find it's free to

4482
02:59:04,070 --> 02:59:01,279
see just head over to netflix and check

4483
02:59:06,950 --> 02:59:04,080
that out it is six episodes

4484
02:59:09,510 --> 02:59:06,960
and stephen bassett richard dolan is is

4485
02:59:10,950 --> 02:59:09,520
excellent in this you have that and then

4486
02:59:11,830 --> 02:59:10,960
of course

4487
02:59:13,590 --> 02:59:11,840
uh

4488
02:59:16,950 --> 02:59:13,600
ross colthardt's

4489
02:59:20,790 --> 02:59:16,960
in plain sight that documentary is now

4490
02:59:22,790 --> 02:59:20,800
available for free worldwide on youtube

4491
02:59:25,750 --> 02:59:22,800
and that is from channel 7 over in

4492
02:59:27,750 --> 02:59:25,760
australia so lots of things just kicked

4493
02:59:28,950 --> 02:59:27,760
off now i also mentioned before i get

4494
02:59:29,910 --> 02:59:28,960
out of here

4495
02:59:34,150 --> 02:59:29,920
um

4496
02:59:36,870 --> 02:59:34,160
kilmer

4497
02:59:42,710 --> 02:59:36,880
i did not know

4498
02:59:44,150 --> 02:59:42,720
jump into this but i didn't realize that

4499
02:59:45,750 --> 02:59:44,160
val

4500
02:59:48,550 --> 02:59:45,760
got throat cancer

4501
02:59:49,990 --> 02:59:48,560
and has lost his voice

4502
02:59:52,150 --> 02:59:50,000
it's uh

4503
02:59:55,510 --> 02:59:52,160
it's incredible it's incredible the man

4504
02:59:58,389 --> 02:59:55,520
is uh very very strong i'll say that

4505
03:00:00,389 --> 02:59:58,399
but uh yes the documentary

4506
03:00:04,150 --> 03:00:00,399
loosely is about that

4507
03:00:07,429 --> 03:00:04,160
but it is a collection of based around

4508
03:00:10,469 --> 03:00:07,439
val had a video camera back when that

4509
03:00:12,870 --> 03:00:10,479
technology was completely brand new and

4510
03:00:15,349 --> 03:00:12,880
he's got a where literally a warehouse

4511
03:00:17,510 --> 03:00:15,359
full of videotapes that he has shot

4512
03:00:18,950 --> 03:00:17,520
uh going back to 19

4513
03:00:19,910 --> 03:00:18,960
1980

4514
03:00:23,110 --> 03:00:19,920
um

4515
03:00:25,510 --> 03:00:23,120
and and his parents ranch and and things

4516
03:00:27,990 --> 03:00:25,520
in in the valley here in southern

4517
03:00:31,590 --> 03:00:28,000
california it's uh pretty incredible his

4518
03:00:34,070 --> 03:00:31,600
parents bought will rogers ranch

4519
03:00:35,349 --> 03:00:34,080
and built a movie studio out of it him

4520
03:00:37,590 --> 03:00:35,359
and his brothers

4521
03:00:40,950 --> 03:00:37,600
and and shot things so it starts then

4522
03:00:42,070 --> 03:00:40,960
and goes all the way through to today

4523
03:00:43,030 --> 03:00:42,080
um

4524
03:00:44,630 --> 03:00:43,040
and

4525
03:00:47,349 --> 03:00:44,640
it's it's a pretty incredible

4526
03:00:49,510 --> 03:00:47,359
documentary so aside from all of the ufo

4527
03:00:53,190 --> 03:00:49,520
stuff that is out there right now

4528
03:00:55,269 --> 03:00:53,200
uh val on amazon is absolutely

4529
03:00:56,150 --> 03:00:55,279
incredible i couldn't stop watching it i

4530
03:00:59,110 --> 03:00:56,160
couldn't

4531
03:01:02,150 --> 03:00:59,120
so i squeezed that in to the other 20

4532
03:01:05,030 --> 03:01:02,160
episodes of ufo stuff that i watched

4533
03:01:06,950 --> 03:01:05,040
this weekend tomorrow night right here

4534
03:01:09,110 --> 03:01:06,960
stephen bassett

4535
03:01:10,870 --> 03:01:09,120
okay all right are we all on the same

4536
03:01:13,429 --> 03:01:10,880
page

4537
03:01:15,190 --> 03:01:13,439
whoo man fade to black is produced by

4538
03:01:17,110 --> 03:01:15,200
hill j palm rene dennis and kevin

4539
03:01:18,630 --> 03:01:17,120
announcers are steve harder gene vettel

4540
03:01:20,950 --> 03:01:18,640
and mark d kovar

4541
03:01:23,870 --> 03:01:20,960
webmaster is drew the geek music doug

4542
03:01:25,670 --> 03:01:23,880
aldrich intro space boy

4543
03:01:27,590 --> 03:01:25,680
spaceboymusic.com paid to black is

4544
03:01:30,870 --> 03:01:27,600
produced by kjcr for the game changer

4545
03:01:32,230 --> 03:01:30,880
network syndication is kgra

4546
03:01:34,870 --> 03:01:32,240
the planet

4547
03:01:36,230 --> 03:01:34,880
it's broadcast owned copyrighted 2021 by

4548
03:01:37,510 --> 03:01:36,240
fade to black and the game changer

4549
03:01:39,429 --> 03:01:37,520
network inc

4550
03:01:41,030 --> 03:01:39,439
it cannot be re-broadcast downloaded

4551
03:01:43,190 --> 03:01:41,040
copied or used anywhere in the known

4552
03:01:44,790 --> 03:01:43,200
universe without written permission from

4553
03:01:46,870 --> 03:01:44,800
fade to black in the game change your

4554
03:01:48,710 --> 03:01:46,880
network i'm your host jimmy church we've

4555
03:01:51,030 --> 03:01:48,720
got an amazing week

4556
03:01:53,910 --> 03:01:51,040
here on fade to black very special

4557
03:01:55,510 --> 03:01:53,920
thanks to richard bleepin dolan tomorrow

4558
03:01:59,110 --> 03:01:55,520
night stephen bassett

4559
03:02:01,349 --> 03:01:59,120
wednesday night dr robert m is shocked

4560
03:02:03,910 --> 03:02:01,359
until tomorrow night with mr bassett i

4561
03:02:38,370 --> 03:02:03,920
want everybody to be safe